Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece mP21R Red Bumblebee Revealed

I always forget, Red bumblebee is "Bumblejumper" and yellow cliffjumber is "Cliffbee" right?

Wouldn't this be Volks?

Windsweeper wrote:Wouldn't this be Volks?

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I always forget, Red bumblebee is "Bumblejumper" and yellow cliffjumber is "Cliffbee" right?

"Bumblejumper" is actually just the toy that was sold on Cliffjumper (and some say Bumblebee) cards in 1984. Completely different sculpt than either Cliff or 'Bee. He was officially christened as Bumper in the early 2000s. http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Bumper_(G1)

Also, Volks is technically orange. http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Volks_(G1).

As Bumblebee and Cliffjumper were both sold in red and yellow versions for the first two years of the toyline, this is just "red Bumblebee".

Also, sidenote......Takara missed an opportunity to do this in blue, with a facemask, and make it Glyph. They'd maximize investment in the mold with minimal to no changes except for plastic/paint color, and have another MP fembot to boot.

Well, I'm dissapointed. A bit. Sure he looks nice and all... But I wanted Cliffjumper. However, this does install an ever so slight hope that Cliffjumper gets to be his own guy, instead of a repaint. That is, if Cliffjumper is coming at all.

I'm gonna make like a TV set and stay tuned.

That was a bad, bad joke.

If its a new character I'll get it.

Even in the masterpiece line, Cliffjumper can't get a new head sculpt.

Jokes aside, they're probably just gonna allocate a name and a bio to the red bumblebee variant from G1, like they did with exhaust.

MemphisR56 wrote:Even in the masterpiece line, Cliffjumper can't get a new head sculpt.

Jokes aside, they're probably just gonna allocate a name and a bio to the red bumblebee variant from G1, like they did with exhaust.

Whenever cliffjumper is away, sometime prime asks bumblebee to dress up like him. He's just like "Bumblebee, just please, I just need some cliffjumper right now."

"J'accuse!"

"Shut the fuck up Cliffbee!

ausbot wrote:If its a new character I'll get it.

Sadly its not...

So many people are going to buy this thinking its cliffjumper whens its just a red verison of bumblebee

Red Bumblebee definitely needs his facemask. That's the only way we've ever seen him.

Wanna bet they include an exo-suit with a Spike head, just to drive the completists crazy?

And here I thought I had my first news credit a 1/2 hour prior. Oh well.

While Has/Tak keep producing repaint after repaint of their overpriced (vs quality) mp line, FanToys, a much smaller company, is already at how many new mold just in 1 year?

I never bought the original Bee but I just got the golden one thinking he would look nice with YOTH Prime. It is a nice figure but is it worth the price? He's so small, light and frail that he feels like voyager class. He's almost legend class height!

In the same delivery I had Tesla. I know he's more expensive but he's also much bigger. Comparing the two I really felt underwhelmed by Bee.

Imo Fanstoys produces exactly what the mp line should be: simple transformation made possible by great engineering, high quality materials (yes, diecast!!!) and great design esthetic. To me the only figures from Has/Tak that truly feel like they deserve the masterpiece name are Prime and Soundwave. But even with those 2 I have been disappointed by poor QC.

Soon, we'll be able to do a direct comparison between a version of the same figure from both company. Is it going to be mp Hound vs Willy or mp Grimlock vs Grinder? Who will win...?

Thormind wrote:I never bought the original Bee but I just got the golden one thinking he would look nice with YOTH Prime. It is a nice figure but is it worth the price? He's so small, light and frail that he feels like voyager class. He's almost legend class height!

That's a pretty far reaching exaggeration on the size. What Legends figure should I go put next to it to see your point? Also, the Bee toys have been very inexpensive. I think G2 Bee was all of $40, if that, from Japanese retailers.

as interesting as this is (and i am looking forward to a proper mp cliffjumper as i already have yellow bee), i'm more interested in wha appears to be a pic of iron hide's under side...

"Bumble Red Body" is the toy's name.

Should have been Stinger, though.

Sabrblade wrote:"Bumble Red Body" is the toy's name.

Should have been Stinger, though.

The official name is Rubber Baby Buggy Bumpers.

MP class is getting on a wierd way... loosing that magic

This does make me wonder how Takara is going to eventually (I'm staying hopeful) do Masterpiece Cliffjumper. The original Bumblebee was a penny-racer version of a VW Beetle. The Masterpiece version is styled after a real VW Beetle, and there is little appreciable difference aesthetically between the figure, the G1 toy, and the G1 cartoon character model.
Cliffjumper is a penny-racer styled Porsche. The cartoon character model from G1 pretty much followed the toy proportions. Will Takara do a realistic Porsche 924 Turbo and be able to make the robot mode into a "Masterpiece" representation of Cliffjumper?

Dang it! I'm really disappointed. Even with a possible (more cliff-jumper-y) third party head sculpt, I don't know if it would look good to diplay him next to bee, because there would be almost no difference between the two. At least the seekers have a relatively good excuse to use the same exact mold.

ScottyP wrote:

Thormind wrote:I never bought the original Bee but I just got the golden one thinking he would look nice with YOTH Prime. It is a nice figure but is it worth the price? He's so small, light and frail that he feels like voyager class. He's almost legend class height!

That's a pretty far reaching exaggeration on the size. What Legends figure should I go put next to it to see your point?

I did say "almost"... Put him beside Powerglide or Cosmos, he isn't too far...

ScottyP wrote:Also, the Bee toys have been very inexpensive. I think G2 Bee was all of $40, if that, from Japanese retailers.

Most "major" retailers have G2 at 64.99$US. Cheapest I could find in Canada on preorder was 74.99$CA (53$US). Cheapest for G1 Bee 79.99$. Leaders sell for 54-59$, Voyagers for 30-35$ and legends for 10-15$ (CA). If I compare him to Leader Megatron, for example, I really don't see any justification for the price outside of the mp title.

I'm just getting tired of Has/Tak not listening to the fans and just "milking" the mp line with repaint after repaint. Just some minor retools on top of the red repaint and they would have produced what we've all been asking (and waiting) for!

Thormind wrote:

ScottyP wrote:

Thormind wrote:I never bought the original Bee but I just got the golden one thinking he would look nice with YOTH Prime. It is a nice figure but is it worth the price? He's so small, light and frail that he feels like voyager class. He's almost legend class height!

That's a pretty far reaching exaggeration on the size. What Legends figure should I go put next to it to see your point?

I did say "almost"... Put him beside Powerglide or Cosmos, he isn't too far...

ScottyP wrote:Also, the Bee toys have been very inexpensive. I think G2 Bee was all of $40, if that, from Japanese retailers.

Most "major" retailers have G2 at 64.99$US. Cheapest I could find in Canada on preorder was 74.99$CA (53$US). Cheapest for G1 Bee 79.99$. Leaders sell for 54-59$, Voyagers for 30-35$ and legends for 10-15$ (CA). If I compare him to Leader Megatron, for example, I really don't see any justification for the price outside of the mp title.

I'm just getting tired of Has/Tak not listening to the fans and just "milking" the mp line with repaint after repaint. Just some minor retools on top of the red repaint and they would have produced what we've all been asking (and waiting) for!

Are you serious? Powerglide is as close to MP Bee in size as a current deluxe is to a voyager. That logic doesn't work.

Also, he clearly stated Japanese retailers. Two "major" Japanese retailers, AmiAmi & HLJ, both sold Bee for under $50.

This is fine. The CJ you're so sore about will happen eventually & be better than Bee with a new head.

Thormind wrote:I did say "almost"... Put him beside Powerglide or Cosmos, he isn't too far...

I did what you said to do.
Then THIS happened.


click to enlarge

Not only am I not surprised by this, I think there would feel like something was missing had they not done this. I remember Way Back In the Day (henceforth WBD), it was easier to find a red Bumblebee on the pegs than a yellow. Also, this just in: after regular Cliffjumper is released, TT will release MP-XXy, Yellow Cliffjumper. Accept it now, it will make it easier later.

Convoy wrote:

Thormind wrote:I did say "almost"... Put him beside Powerglide or Cosmos, he isn't too far...

I did what you said to do.
Then THIS happened.


click to enlarge

That just made this whole thread fixed up and wonderful again. Five points to House Convoy

Thormind wrote:Most "major" retailers have G2 at 64.99$US. Cheapest I could find in Canada on preorder was 74.99$CA (53$US). Cheapest for G1 Bee 79.99$. Leaders sell for 54-59$, Voyagers for 30-35$ and legends for 10-15$ (CA). If I compare him to Leader Megatron, for example, I really don't see any justification for the price outside of the mp title.

G2 Bee only cost me US$39 shipped, you just have to know where to buy them.

Also we're talking about Japanese figures so we need to compare his price to other Japanese figures. MSRP on G2 Bee was 5,500JPY (taxed) while Leader class figures are 7,500JPY, the same as MP Tracks. Knocking 2,000JPY off the price seems fair to me.

And BTW, nobody is being forced to buy red Bee or blue Bluestreak or any other minor redeco. So far they haven't included anything that fans MUST HAVE to complete the line. Their presence helps to fund new figures in the future and they rarely take the place of another figure in the line. I don't see anything at all wrong with Takara Tomy making them.

I do wish they would have really taken a leap and done Bugbite or Wasp so we could get some more bad guys in this line.

Emerje

Milk the mold! I am going to have to pass.

Emerje wrote:I do wish they would have really taken a leap and done Bugbite or Wasp so we could get some more bad guys in this line.

Red Bee could have been Stinger.

.... But.... Why?

I would've loved to get a white and purple version and call it Bug Bite. We deeeeeefinitely need more Decepticons in the Masterpiece line any way we can get them.

Bounti76 wrote:
Also, sidenote......Takara missed an opportunity to do this in blue, with a facemask, and make it Glyph. They'd maximize investment in the mold with minimal to no changes except for plastic/paint color, and have another MP fembot to boot.

Also this, and also, I didn't know Glyph was a fembot!

DecepticonFinishline wrote:.... But.... Why?

To cash in on the nostalgia of this figure:



I'm sure we'll get a yellow MP Cliff at some point after we get a red one, too.

Convoy wrote:

Thormind wrote:I did say "almost"... Put him beside Powerglide or Cosmos, he isn't too far...

I did what you said to do.
Then THIS happened.


click to enlarge

Ok, with another perspective...



Were talking about what, 1" difference? A better example if you want:



Hes actually bigger, about same quality. Ok he's got a bit less articulations, but not that much. Is there really a 40$ worth difference between them? "Bee" honest...

Some other examples:





Has for some Japanese store offering him for much less that's good to know and might be worth taking a look, thanks. But 40$US is 54$CA and normally you need to add import/custom fees on top of that. And the shipping cost will usually be higher than if you order from Canada/US. At least that's how it works in Canada, if the store is not acting legally. In the end I'm pretty sure that 40$ will be closer (or higher) than 65$.

But i'll take a look and would be glad to be wrong on that one. Any Canadian buyers can tell me the best store to deal with and get those low prices?

Also, I think you missed the point of my original post, or maybe I was not clear enough. A much smaller company can release new molds after new molds of figures the fans really want. They only do a reasonable amount of repaints, just to please the fans by making G1,G2,Toys and Diaclone versions. All their products so far are of much better quality.

My 1st FT was Soar. When I got him and compared to my MPs I felt like for the first time I was handling a true masterpiece product. Why cant Has/Tak have that kind of commitment, care and dare I say "love" for their mp line?

FansToys is releasing their Slag 3 times & their Snarl 4 times. I'm not sure what your definition of reasonable is but I don't think that's a good argument. Also, Cosmos comes up to Bee's abdomen. I'm not sure what your argument is there either.

Doctor McGrath wrote:FansToys is releasing their Slag 3 times & their Snarl 4 times. I'm not sure what your definition of reasonable is but I don't think that's a good argument. Also, Cosmos comes up to Bee's abdomen. I'm not sure what your argument is there either.

Lets agree to disagree then. To me the FT repaints are to please the fans. I'm sure not many people will buy more than one variant of the same figure and it does not look like it's their intention. For example I prefer the black version of Sever so I will just get that version. Most variations are announced in advance so we can choose. They do not do this to sell many versions of the same mold to the same buyer but to allow him to get the one he really wants. At least that's how it feels to me.

I don't think many of us wanted a red Bee. What we wanted is Cliffjumper. I think (just an opinion) that they are making the red version to give us something like a Cliff. To me it feels like a lame attempt at making quick and easy money with minimal care for us. I bet Cliff wont be coming out anytime soon now. I do hope time will prove me wrong but I doubt.

I am not satisfied with only a few new molds per year and a load of repaint/retool. Many of us think they are becoming to greedy. Look at the CW line. How many time are they reusing the same molds? They are even making some placeholder limbs just to sell us the proper ones later at a higher price. There was Quickslinger and Breakneck and there will almost for sure be Groove and Blastoff. I'm sure it's not necessary at all for them to be profitable. It's milking...

FT is proving that you can release many new mold per year, with high quality materials, and still be profitable. No reason Has/Tak cant do the same.

As for size, I did give better examples...

You're comparing apples to oranges & speaking as if you're the voice of the fandom. Since FansToys listens to what you want, maybe you should tell them you want a Cliffjumper.

Takara is dealing with licenses with these MP's while the third parties are clearly not. When the license is acquired from Porche or whoever, I'm sure we will get a good looking CJ. And then hopefully Jazz! The Repaints coming out aren't required buys. They are for niche collectors & collections just like a diaclone colored Snarl. This red BB isn't taking the place of any beloved character.

Doctor McGrath wrote:You're comparing apples to oranges & speaking as if you're the voice of the fandom. Since FansToys listens to what you want, maybe you should tell them you want a Cliffjumper.

I did try to present all this as my own opinion. I'm sure some will agree

padfoo wrote:Milk the mold! I am going to have to pass.

and some won't. No need to become aggressive or personal...

Doctor McGrath wrote: They are for niche collectors & collections just like a diaclone colored Snarl. This red BB isn't taking the place of any beloved character.

You have your opinions just like I have mine. I do not present mine like a fact... (well I try not to)

Haha, right on.

This thread actually did get me thinking about licensing costs. Q-Transformers are, mostly, officially licensed vehicles. They're almost $9 retail in Japan, and smaller/less complex than most $6 Legions are over here. Gotta be due to the licensing, eh? Wish I had anything besides anecdotal evidence to base that on.

Preorders up for MP-21R from RobotKingdom
http://www.robotkingdom.com/tftrmp21r.html

"Pertinent Quotes"
I hate to admit it, but...
You're not entirely wrong.
After I got MP-01 (Mostly in scale with Binaltech/Alternators.) I figured the future release of MP Jazz would almost need two hands to hold.
Oddly enough this thread got me thinking about licensing too.
In real life, the guy who designed the classic VW is the same guy who designed the classic Porche.
(Pretty sure both are owned by the same company now.(Chrysler?))
I wonder at this point if TakTom doesn't already have the rights to Porche with the rights to Volkswagon.
At any rate, if that's the case, I'm a little afraid that Jazz will be the size of Cliffjumper who will be the size of Bumblebee, who, despite his robot mode has a tiny altmode. (I realized this after transforming him after his photo shoot and walked in on him.) BB is a complex CHUG deluxe. (Still worth hunting for the right price w/exo-suit, IMHO.)
side note: CW is a Hasbro baby. MP is a TakaraTomy baby. Now and then one "fixes" the other.
Did I forget anything?
I don't think I'm feeding a troll and I think this thread is on her last legs anyway.
MP Jazz!

Takara is basing the scaling on the Masterpiece line, beginning with MP-10, on the robot modes and their relative sizes in the cartoon. So, MP-10 Optimus Prime is in scale with MP-21 Bumblebee in robot mode, but NOT in vehicle mode. Even for a VW Beetle, MP Bumblebee is undersized in vehicle mode compared to Optimus or even most of the other Autobot cars. Jazz will be about the same size as Sideswipe, Prowl, and Wheeljack in robot mode, believe me. His alt mode will be whatever size it needs to be to fit the requisite robot mode scale.

Wolfman Jake wrote:Takara is basing the scaling on the Masterpiece line, beginning with MP-10, on the robot modes and their relative sizes in the cartoon. So, MP-10 Optimus Prime is in scale with MP-21 Bumblebee in robot mode, but NOT in vehicle mode. Even for a VW Beetle, MP Bumblebee is undersized in vehicle mode compared to Optimus or even most of the other Autobot cars. Jazz will be about the same size as Sideswipe, Prowl, and Wheeljack in robot mode, believe me. His alt mode will be whatever size it needs to be to fit the requisite robot mode scale.

Bingo! They're just scaling the robots and the alt modes do what they do. Soundwave is both a good example of this (gigantic tape deck so that the 'bot scales) and a counterpoint to it (cassettes are the size they are to fit into Soundwave, so driven by alt mode size primarily).

Is this some sort of convention or Webstore exclusive? or are we expecting the usual Japanese retailers to get these too?

mooncake623 wrote:Is this some sort of convention or Webstore exclusive? or are we expecting the usual Japanese retailers to get these too?

Cybertron Satellite exclusive.

Sabrblade wrote:

mooncake623 wrote:Is this some sort of convention or Webstore exclusive? or are we expecting the usual Japanese retailers to get these too?

Cybertron Satellite exclusive.

Awesome

ScottyP wrote:This thread actually did get me thinking about licensing costs. Q-Transformers are, mostly, officially licensed vehicles. They're almost $9 retail in Japan, and smaller/less complex than most $6 Legions are over here. Gotta be due to the licensing, eh? Wish I had anything besides anecdotal evidence to base that on.

The Q-Transformers are mass produced, MPs are not. The licencing cost is more spread out and easily made up for the Q-Transformers while a more limited item like the MPs have to charge more to make up for the cost.

Railbomb wrote:

ScottyP wrote:This thread actually did get me thinking about licensing costs. Q-Transformers are, mostly, officially licensed vehicles. They're almost $9 retail in Japan, and smaller/less complex than most $6 Legions are over here. Gotta be due to the licensing, eh? Wish I had anything besides anecdotal evidence to base that on.

The Q-Transformers are mass produced, MPs are not. The licencing cost is more spread out and easily made up for the Q-Transformers while a more limited item like the MPs have to charge more to make up for the cost.

If MP Transformers aren't mass produced, I feel even worse about spending all the money I have on the Masterpiece line

Ya know, we REALLY need a Masterpiece Elita-1. Just sayin.

SillySpringer wrote:Ya know, we REALLY need a Masterpiece Elita-1. Just sayin.

Seconded.

LegendaryAntiHero wrote:

Railbomb wrote:

ScottyP wrote:This thread actually did get me thinking about licensing costs. Q-Transformers are, mostly, officially licensed vehicles. They're almost $9 retail in Japan, and smaller/less complex than most $6 Legions are over here. Gotta be due to the licensing, eh? Wish I had anything besides anecdotal evidence to base that on.

The Q-Transformers are mass produced, MPs are not. The licencing cost is more spread out and easily made up for the Q-Transformers while a more limited item like the MPs have to charge more to make up for the cost.

If MP Transformers aren't mass produced, I feel even worse about spending all the money I have on the Masterpiece line

I don't understand this sentiment. Why would you feel worse about spending money on an item that is not "mass produced" or, as I assume you mean, rare? Furthermore, Masterpiece figures ARE mass produced. That's how all Transformers toys are made in the factories. That's mass production, period. Yes, the production runs are lower than other toys made for the general consuming public, being that they are geared towards collectors and sold at premium prices, but they are still made altogether in very appreciable quantities at given point in time. Masterpiece figures are not made to order.

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:

SillySpringer wrote:Ya know, we REALLY need a Masterpiece Elita-1. Just sayin.

Seconded.

Most people will say that this is good enough:

But to me, she ain't g1 accurate enough, and she's too small. She needs to at least be MP car sized.

SillySpringer wrote:

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:

SillySpringer wrote:Ya know, we REALLY need a Masterpiece Elita-1. Just sayin.

Seconded.

Most people will say that this is good enough:

But to me, she ain't g1 accurate enough, and she's too small. She needs to at least be MP car sized.

Most people will say that's good enough for a classics collection...