New Galleries: War for Cybertron SIEGE Battle Masters Blowpipe, Firedrive and Lionizer

Have you seen the complaints that WFC-S figures are smaller than the previous figures? Well are they smaller? In terms of height, some Siege figures are slightly shorter yes, but in terms of mass? Well let's use facts here, people say that TR Megs is bigger than WFC-S Megs, well in terms of mass (g) the latter is bigger. Here are a few other comparisons. Based on the weights, the figures have NOT decreased in mass at all. The unified scale is the explanation as to why some are shorter. All in all, Siege is a massive improvement.

There is a misconception of cost / height, the height of a figure in relation to cost, saving, cutting etc is irrelevant, the weight is relevant, pay per gram not per inch, raw materials go by raw weight.

Carnivius_Prime wrote:Hm have to say I'm more into how well they display with other figures as part of a collection, than I am about how much they weigh (their weight means nothing to me when gazing at them on my shelves).

Skritz wrote:Can't wait to get a matching Targetmaster for my Triggerhappy and Hot Rod.

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:

Skritz wrote:Can't wait to get a matching Targetmaster for my Triggerhappy and Hot Rod.

Oh yeah. Cog and the Battle Masters are still very definitely "Take my money!" Even if Firedrive needs a mod right out of the package (migrating the barrel mount to the back of his knees) I'm still excited for him.

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:

Skritz wrote:Can't wait to get a matching Targetmaster for my Triggerhappy and Hot Rod.

Oh yeah. Cog and the Battle Masters are still very definitely "Take my money!" Even if Firedrive needs a mod right out of the package (migrating the barrel mount to the back of his knees) I'm still excited for him.

That would make him more similar to Pinpointer:

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:But I see what you're going for. Still, G1 toy accuracy isn't all that's "crack"ed up to be (ha ha):

omega666 wrote:Ok. Now weigh an $20 voyager Classics Optimus with this new $30 Optimus.

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:Agreed. Here I was looking forward to Siege Sideswipe as a cheaper alternative to the Universe one. But now...


Now, not so much.

Wolfman Jake wrote:

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:Agreed. Here I was looking forward to Siege Sideswipe as a cheaper alternative to the Universe one. But now...


Now, not so much.

The Universe 2008 Sideswipe/Sunstreaker mold is REALLY big for a Deluxe Class figure, even back in the day, when all size classes were generally larger than they are now. It really makes what are essentially current par for the course sized figures look small by (unfair) comparison. Just judging by the comparison pics in the Seibertron galleriers, I can assure you that Siege Sideswipe is not as short as he seems next to his Universe 2008 counterpart, and out of context with contemporary Deluxe Class figures. He'll scale very nicely with anything from Thriling 30 onward.

Flashwave wrote:Except the fan gripe is not solely limited to one figure, the toyline as a whole is averaging down. I'm not a Scale guy, as long as Big Guys are Big and Little Guys are Little, ans the size of things doeant really bother me, but they arent wrong in saying that the Deluxes as a qhole are shorter. Siege Hound is smaller than Universe Hound, and by comparion he's not nearly the biggest oy out of his pruce range. Am I gwtting Siege Hound? Absolutely, I want a g
Figure with a better foot and the clip that holds on the holp generator on my Uni Hound is showing a stress fracture. But I'm not sure I will even see him above the other guys on my shelf.

Wolfman Jake wrote:

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:Agreed. Here I was looking forward to Siege Sideswipe as a cheaper alternative to the Universe one. But now...


Now, not so much.

The Universe 2008 Sideswipe/Sunstreaker mold is REALLY big for a Deluxe Class figure, even back in the day, when all size classes were generally larger than they are now. It really makes what are essentially current par for the course sized figures look small by (unfair) comparison. Just judging by the comparison pics in the Seibertron galleriers, I can assure you that Siege Sideswipe is not as short as he seems next to his Universe 2008 counterpart, and out of context with contemporary Deluxe Class figures. He'll scale very nicely with anything from Thriling 30 onward.

Wolfman Jake wrote:Take a look at these comparisons between only two figures at a time:

Suddenly, those height differences look a LOT less drastic. We've got nice, close up shots of these figures paired together in our "near vision field," making for less "guesstimating" on the part of our visual processing.

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:The weight is an important factor to consider, because of a property you should have learned in physics: density.

Even if the figures shrink in terms of height or volume, if the weight (technically its mass) remains the same, more is squeezed into a certain space, which results into more being possible when it comes to transformation, articulation and possibly the thickness and quality of the plastic.

Out of curiosity, with the standards set by Siege, how do figures of other lines weigh in? Not just the current Cyberverse line, but older main lines as well.

Z3ROhour wrote:is anyone else bothered
by the fact
that Skytread
doesn't become
two separate bots
as well as vehicles?

or is that just me?

maybe i missed a post.

Hellscream9999 wrote:

Z3ROhour wrote:is anyone else bothered
by the fact
that Skytread
doesn't become
two separate bots
as well as vehicles?

or is that just me?

maybe i missed a post.

I am, but I guess we're in the minority

Z3ROhour wrote:is anyone else bothered
by the fact
that Skytread
doesn't become
two separate bots
as well as vehicles?

or is that just me?

maybe i missed a post.

durroth wrote:

Hellscream9999 wrote:

Z3ROhour wrote:is anyone else bothered
by the fact
that Skytread
doesn't become
two separate bots
as well as vehicles?

or is that just me?

maybe i missed a post.

I am, but I guess we're in the minority

Honestly I'm more bothered by the fact Battletrap *does*, but that's just me.

william-james88 wrote:The recent Seibertron galleries have shown the Transformers Siege toys to be smaller than previous incarnations. For instance, Siege Megatron and Hound are shorter than Titans Return Megatron and Combiner Wars Hound respectively. But does that mean we are getting ripped off? Especially since the MSRP is now $19.99 for deluxes and $29.99 for voyagers? Well ‎TF Fan West Lee, on Facebook, chose to look at this from a mass perspective. Figures in the past might be tall but if they are hollow, a very common complaint from fans, then maybe fixing that aspect might mean more material and thus lower the overall height for this line. And he found that this line offers more in terms of mass (and thus meterial) than previous lines. Here is what he had to say along with the images showing that Siege Megatron, for instance, has much more material than most other voyagers.

o.supreme wrote:So...our toys are getting fatter, like me, not necessarily a good thing

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:Power of the Primes had a mandate that all regular retail Deluxes be combiner limbs, so Battletrap was forced to be split between two Legends-class releases to come out at normal retail. Battleslash and Roadtrap were hastily made up because Hasbro couldn't justifiably sell toys that, on their own, were only half a robot.

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:Agreed. Here I was looking forward to Siege Sideswipe as a cheaper alternative to the Universe one. But now...


Now, not so much.

Black Hat wrote:You know one of the things I'm happiest about with Siege? The Weaponizer gimmick is entirely based around 5mm ports, which means not only can you (as Ryan did) go crazy with mega-combinations, but literally any figure with 5mm ports is technically cross-compatible with the line. Like, if I'm not very much mistaken, Cog's torso/shield component could easily mount on Rook's shoulder, which combined with his already-present "power fist" gimmick with his combiner hand would allow for him to take his "violence arm" thing up to 11. Likewise, MechTech figures from DOTM made ample use of 5mm pegs and ports, so they can join in the fun too.

o.supreme wrote:

ZeldaTheSwordsman wrote:Power of the Primes had a mandate that all regular retail Deluxes be combiner limbs, so Battletrap was forced to be split between two Legends-class releases to come out at normal retail. Battleslash and Roadtrap were hastily made up because Hasbro couldn't justifiably sell toys that, on their own, were only half a robot.

I know you added that "retail" part to justify Punch/Counterpunch, but I'd like to see said mandate. Also you can spin it the opposite way. One could say that Skytread was initially planned to be part of PotP, but because it was reduced to a 12 month line, Hasbro cut costs by ditching the individual bot mode designs, and just released it as a deluxe for the Siege line. ...I'm not saying this has any merit, but it is just as likely theorizing.

Hellscream9999 wrote:

Z3ROhour wrote:is anyone else bothered
by the fact
that Skytread
doesn't become
two separate bots
as well as vehicles?

or is that just me?

maybe i missed a post.

I am, but I guess we're in the minority

Galvatronian wrote:Hadn't quite seen it that way, as like some others I agreed that battletrap should have been like skytread, but you reminded me of the joy of him when I first got him (having no idea there was a combined mode) and just exactly why it won toy of the year.
On the other note, we ask for less hollow transformers, they give it, then we're unhappy they are smaller? it just stands to reason, you can't have tall toys, no hallowness, the same price, good in both alts modes AND that intuitive/complex but not too complex, with a twist of clever transformation, it just doesn't work. More plastic, higher price. Scale up sideswipe or hound by a cm (1/3 of an inch), and it's volume increases a lot, probably putting up to voyager price point. If you really want perfect bots to perfect scale, not just fun kids toys with a g1 aesthetic buy masterpiece!

Emerje wrote:I'm fine with some easily hidden gaps in the torso and hollowness in the arms and legs like we mostly see in combiners. What I can't overlook is what we've seen with Ironhide and his gaping holes.



How did that even get out of the production stage!? I'm seriously on the fence about getting him, he had better be a surprisingly large Deluxe to make up for all that empty space in his back and arms, but I doubt it looking at his SDCC display.

Emerje

Emerje wrote:I'm fine with some easily hidden gaps in the torso and hollowness in the arms and legs like we mostly see in combiners. What I can't overlook is what we've seen with Ironhide and his gaping holes.



How did that even get out of the production stage!? I'm seriously on the fence about getting him, he had better be a surprisingly large Deluxe to make up for all that empty space in his back and arms, but I doubt it looking at his SDCC display.

Emerje

Wireless_Phantom wrote:

Emerje wrote:I'm fine with some easily hidden gaps in the torso and hollowness in the arms and legs like we mostly see in combiners. What I can't overlook is what we've seen with Ironhide and his gaping holes.



How did that even get out of the production stage!? I'm seriously on the fence about getting him, he had better be a surprisingly large Deluxe to make up for all that empty space in his back and arms, but I doubt it looking at his SDCC display.

Emerje

To be fair I think that the hole in the back is where the head goes. The fore-arms are a bit annoying but there may be a reason.

Amelie wrote:Its possible the backs of the arms had to be hollow because of how the toy was being cast\molded.

Emerje wrote:I'm fine with some easily hidden gaps in the torso and hollowness in the arms and legs like we mostly see in combiners. What I can't overlook is what we've seen with Ironhide and his gaping holes.



How did that even get out of the production stage!? I'm seriously on the fence about getting him, he had better be a surprisingly large Deluxe to make up for all that empty space in his back and arms, but I doubt it looking at his SDCC display.

Emerje