Generations Wheeljack and Thundercracker revealed

Sexy.

With the release of the new Thundercracker the Botcon version will be worthless.
Everybody should just give me theirs so they can replace it with a less special, mass release NEW and SHINEY retail Thundercracker. That will solve all the problems.

He looks awesome, like the bastard child of the Henkei and the Classics version. And since there's a big chance that he'll be of the same quality as Thrust and Dirge, I'll likely get him, and Universe Starscream and Skywarp when he gets made, damn henkei and Classics Seekers in my collection?

Chaoslock wrote:I see and agree that releasing every Botcon exclusive would hurt the business badly, but one of my points was that choosing the seekers as exclusives was a VERY bad idea, especially at the dawn of the Classics releases.
That is why FunPub should choose what it wants as exclusives wisely (and Hasbro to agree with anything to be exclusive to somebody). They have to be interesting enough for collectors, but the release not scales smaller than the worldwide demand.

Thanks, I agree it was a bungled choice, but as deadmetal stated, it was the best choice for the market at the time.

the truly tricky part is your second point, choosing exclusives that wont have enough demand from casual fans to be viable at retail, but enticing enough to hardcore collectors to make botcon financially viable to the TFCC.

its a slippery slope, thundercracker was a bad choice clearly, but what other choices would be up for argument? G2 redux was a safe choice, but what if the next set was the protectobots? what side would we argue for then? good exclusives, or deprived fans who want a shot at retail classics protectobots?

It Is Him wrote:Generations Thundercracker will not ruin Botcon forever. There is no slippery slope.

that is a conclusion, not an argument.

a conclusion with nothing to back it up. You would be surprised how even a show as large as botcon can be just a few bad choices from not making a profit. the overhead is ridiculously high, its a big risk business wise.

doesnt matter now as nothing has happened yet. I am curious to see what the botcon landscape will look like down the road if this becomes common.

anyone else notice that wheeljacks "wings" are repaints of tracks istead of the new molded one on the early pics
HASBRO FAIL
this wave is still mine though

Sid Burn wrote:

It Is Him wrote:Generations Thundercracker will not ruin Botcon forever. There is no slippery slope.

that is a conclusion, not an argument.

a conclusion with nothing to back it up.

RUINED FOREVER

You're not the first to think so, and you won't be the last.

Boy am I pissed that SE Overkill was released. That really ruined forever the customization classes at Botcon. Now no one wants to attend those. Funpub might as well pack their bags and move on to something bigger and better.

Oh, Thundercracker, you gorgeous thing. I cannot wait to have you on my shelf.

Well, this has made my holiday season jollier than ever. I have been waiting forever to get a Classics Wheeljack.






I just hope they make Skywarp and Ramjet for those who were idiots and did not buy them in classics 1, like me.

Now all I need is for Hasbro to do Sunstorm and the rest of the Rainmakers.....

Sid Burn wrote:Think you are a little hung up on the term "crappy" from my post. That is simply my opinion.
There are many who see no difference at all that would sway them.

Not really, I respect all opinions, and I thought your term said something about what you thought of the quality of the Dirge I was finally able to purchase (my only Seeker as a kid, so that meant something special to me to get the update).

My point regarding what TFCC makes available (for those who are fortunate to be members) at Botcon (and otherwise) is that members should get the best of quality control, and that if they are getting something the general public will one day demand and receive (as with the Seekers), they are paying to get it NOW, not years later.

Plus, those wings on Botcon Thrust are a better mold in my opinion than the Takara and now Hasbro release. And I think you got Ramjet's bombs with that, which I wish would have come with all the general release coneheads. So in my eyes, you have something unique and superior to what I have, and that's what TFCC should be offering, aside from the NOW factor.

What I am trying to paint for all of you is a situation where the TFCC cannot draw demand for their exclusives and therefore cannot fund their conventions the way they can now. Everything that makes botcon special costs money, it doesnt happen by magic. The venues alone...

I am not saying this is happening right now, hopefully it wont ever happen. But releasing those seekers at retail is setting the precedent. Every situation no matter how great or horrible is set off by one action.

If it does go that way, and the TF community no longer has botcon the way it was, it will be a shame.
get it?

First, I think you meant to use this on me:

Second, I completely understand your point about the need for TFCC to have an ability to offer things that make TFCC worth while. But I would think what truly funds Botcon is the attendance more than the TFCC exclusives. As I expressed near the end of my post, it's a convention I would love to attend. It's an experience I would love to be a part of. To interact with the people who gave me something special as a child and make me feel good as an adult and give me something to share with the next generation, that's something special. To meet people from all over and talk about the hobby, the brand, the experience, the meaning, that's what conventions are about to me.

I will never forget meeting the Dark Detevtive team when they came to the Motorcity Comicon as part of their promotion tour. I had an opportunity to chat with the late great Marshall Rogers for over an hour because I went early on Friday instead of Sunday and hardly anyone was getting in line at that point. Spending time with him and Terry Austin talking about all things Batman was the greatest experience as a fan I have ever had. They could have brushed me off entirely, but they enjoyed the conversation, and they challenged me as a fellow fan, because that's what they were too at that point, artists who once worked on the comic and just recently were invited back to tell a sequel.

We talked about what it was like when they first worked with Steve Engelhart on Strange Apparitions, back when Batman was returning to his roots after the 60's run. I got to delve into what they thought Batman was about, who was the man, who was the mask? I was able to find a copy of their collection (SA TPB) for all of them to sign while I waited for Engelhart to arrive (he was running behind schedule). I got to hear what they thought of Batman:TAS and what it meant to have part of their story featured as one of the best episodes of the series, The Laughing Fish (with some minor changes to fit the TAS story). We pondered about what the new live action movie Batman Begins would be like, what our expectations were and how much we believed this movie would do what the others could not, bring the essence of Batman to the big screen.

And after Engelhart arrived and signed everything I had brought (and bought there), they took a picture with me that I will cherish for as long as I live and beyond (though I won't get to take that picture with me, but then neither will I get to take my TF's). I looked forward to their next tour for their next Dark Detective story, but it won't be the same because I won't be able to ask Marshall Rogers his thoughts on the new movies, though I think I already know how that conversation would have gone.

Conventions are more than collecting stuff, they are about experiencing something that only can happen by paying the price of admission. TFCC, as pointed out by others, needs to find ways to offer things that WILL remain unique to collectors, but without forcing Hasbro to hold back production on mainstream characters. Releasing the Seekers corrects a selfish mistake by TFCC and Hasbro. If any precedence has been set now and for the future, it's that TFCC does not have a right to monopolize the mainstream character market, be it for well known US characters, or well known Japanese (and European) characters, especially if the mold is made and ready for use. No fan should be prevented from acquiring a well known character from retail.

There are lots of characters and character concepts that TFCC has used and can use that will not see retail release, not due to lack of collector demand, but because there is not enough profitability to use/alter/make new molds to sell those characters. A great mold was made for Starscream that automatically should have led to the release of his fellow Seekers in that or the following line. The coneheads are no different, but TFCC did make exclusive wing molds that will never be available to outsiders, so at least Botcon Thrust will always be unique. They could have done that for Dirge, too. And they could have taken Cybertron Starscream and released all of the Seekers in that Cybertronian mold. Why haven't they? Why hasn't Hasbro done that with the voyager and/or legends class mold? Why did the paint scheme on Dirge look so terrible for the only other Seeker released as a Voyager from the Cybertron mold?

TFCC has options. Lots of options. Punch/Counterpunch and the entire G2 theme is something special. And just because we are getting Scourge on retail does not mean the Botcon Scourge and Sweeps are useless. They are unique, and the mold they used fits the characters a lot better than the new one. I'm glad I'll be able to get the new one, but I'm only getting one, not building an army. I've read that a number of people here will be keeping their Botcon Sweeps on display because of how good they are. If I had the Botcon Sweeps, I might not bother with the new Scourge at all.

If the future of Botcon is truly tied to the exclusive TFCC products, then Botcon is doomed to fail. But if Botcon is what I imagine it to be, the ultimate Transformers experience, then the only issue TFCC faces with its exclusives is choosing unique ways to represent characters that Hasbro and Takara won't. I think they've hit some home runs, like Alpha Trion, but they have also struck out, and Thundercracker is one of the latter.

(to check off the rest of what you said, I could care less about KOs, I dont sell items from my personal collection and the botcon seekers are certainly not unique any longer.)

Thrust is. As for the rest, again, it was selfish of TFCC to try and prevent everyone else from having them, especially since the brand would be dead without the retail market. Anyone who thinks otherwise is stuck in the past. Simple as that.

You know, I'm simply looking at it like this. It's great that Botcon does the exclusives, but not everyone can attend them all. And not everyone can afford to pay the price for them once they are in the secondary market at 15 times the original cost (i say that is unfair to a collector that loves them). I know I can't. And I know there are alot of people out there who can't either. Plus think of the kids who love transformers right now. I think these should be continued to be released for them too. Someone has to keep the line going for future generations. I know this ramble may not make sense, but it's all I got for right now. Even if Hasbro releasing toys brings down the value of exclusives, it's doing nothing more than showing us how stupid we are for spending the obscene amounts of money for these things.......

First-Aid wrote:Once again, being a cheap-ass pays off in the end. I refused to splurge on the Henkei. I refused to splurge on the BotCon set. Now I am rewarded for being cheap with the completion of my Classics seekers set...


...actually i was just too broke to get the other stuff...

Ditto.

Now if only Hasbro would release Botcon's Alpha Trion...

*crosses fingers*

Finally a Classics Wheeljack! It seems 2011 will be a good year for G1 fans.

Come to think of it...

In 25 years Hasbro will probably release completely new and updated versions of popular characters, even of characters they are currently updating?

Think about it.

How many people want voyager class Seekers? With the deluxe class G1 Seeker collection close to completion, we could be maybe a decade away from a completely new and larger mold with no undercarriage kibble.

And with TF:Prime soon to be rolling out its first complete season it won't be long before we get a toy line that represents that series' representations of characters who have existed in numerous forms since their initial Diaclone release, among the other original toy lines that Transformers based itself off of.

Does that mean my retail Seeker collection will be worthless? What about my Classics/Generation/RTS collection?

And what if the next set of movies features completely different engineering from anything we've seen before?

And does the possible alteration to BB Prime for the new movie make the one I just picked up no longer unique?

And don't get me started on Bumblebee. Just the concept car releases of the first movie, the alterations for the second with the gun arm, the new molding for the upper body with the shoulder cannons, and of BBBB, which has been updated to represent the movie update as well as whatever that new gimmick is...



I may as well stop collecting right now because it will all be redone bigger and better for the 50th anniversary.

headsortails wrote:You know, I'm simply looking at it like this. It's great that Botcon does the exclusives, but not everyone can attend them all. And not everyone can afford to pay the price for them once they are in the secondary market at 15 times the original cost (i say that is unfair to a collector that loves them). I know I can't. And I know there are alot of people out there who can't either. Plus think of the kids who love transformers right now. I think these should be continued to be released for them too. Someone has to keep the line going for future generations. I know this ramble may not make sense, but it's all I got for right now. Even if Hasbro releasing toys brings down the value of exclusives, it's doing nothing more than showing us how stupid we are for spending the obscene amounts of money for these things.......

You're not rambling. I understand you perfectly, and I totally agree.

Joetx wrote:

First-Aid wrote:Once again, being a cheap-ass pays off in the end. I refused to splurge on the Henkei. I refused to splurge on the BotCon set. Now I am rewarded for being cheap with the completion of my Classics seekers set...


...actually i was just too broke to get the other stuff...

Ditto.

Now if only Hasbro would release Botcon's Alpha Trion...

*crosses fingers*

I disagree with Hasbro releasing Botcon's Alpha Trion, that's their A3. They took a mold and found a way to make it better at a time when Hasbro was not remolding heads to match the repaints and name changes. That version belongs to them. If Hasbro does release an Alpha Trion (that has nothing to do with the movie-verse) I want a sleek mold that looks as much like the animation model as possible, in deluxe size. If there is a WFC Alpha Trion character model, I'll settle for that. But BCA3 is not a Seeker. So here's hoping for something else for us retail shoppers.

Beautiful.

I'm sorry, but they have to release a new Skywarp now. That release a few years ago was just a cheap exclusive combo piece with a weak-looking color scheme and last-minute paint apps. To keep up with the current quality, and thus offer a truly complete array, they have to put out a new Skywarp.

This great news. First the cone heads and now the original seekers shall be complete as well. Looks like Ill be doing another group review.

You gotta be fuckin' kidding me... What's the point of buying a Botcon exclusive, a toy that's only made for a specific few, when it's just going to be released at retail 3 and a half years later? I hate this.

Nemesis_Apoc wrote:You gotta be **** kidding me... What's the point of buying a Botcon exclusive, a toy that's only made for a specific few, when it's just going to be released at retail 3 and a half years later? I hate this.

The point is you still have a botcon exclusive. You will alway have a botcon exclusive. A generations release with a different deco doesn't change that. Yours will not crumble to dust now.

i cant remember for the life of me, is scourge the tracker? and is cyclonus the one with his armada?

chrisc4 wrote:i cant remember for the life of me, is scourge the tracker? and is cyclonus the one with his armada?

Rumble was the one that turned into a casette.

craggy wrote:

chrisc4 wrote:i cant remember for the life of me, is scourge the tracker? and is cyclonus the one with his armada?

Rumble was the one that turned into a casette.

Exactly, Wheelie is the one that rhymes.

craggy wrote:

chrisc4 wrote:i cant remember for the life of me, is scourge the tracker? and is cyclonus the one with his armada?

Rumble was the one that turned into a casette.

And the red one.

Cyclonus is the tracker. Scourge has the generic armada. You gotta brush up on your G1! Scourge was barely even a character. He was practically just an easy write-in for disposable Decepticon soldiers. It was never clear if there was a real leader or just a hive-mind. They always kinda reminded me of the flying monkeys from Wizard of Oz when I was a kid. Their ridiculous red nail polish didn't help me take them any more seriously. With that said, I'm definitely buying it, lol!

HalfOfMe! "ridiculous red nail polish"? IT WAS PINK NAIL POLISH!

It Is Him wrote:

craggy wrote:

chrisc4 wrote:i cant remember for the life of me, is scourge the tracker? and is cyclonus the one with his armada?

Rumble was the one that turned into a casette.

Exactly, Wheelie is the one that rhymes.

Truck not monkey.


Eeeeef. They used the Classics seeker mould. Scrap that bo'shit and make a new better seeker mould already!

Nemesis_Apoc wrote:You gotta be **** kidding me... What's the point of buying a Botcon exclusive, a toy that's only made for a specific few, when it's just going to be released at retail 3 and a half years later? I hate this.

You still have your exclusive. Hasbro's not busting into your house to steal it.

Oh, Thundercracker you sexy thing... come to Striker...

craggy wrote:HalfOfMe! "ridiculous red nail polish"? IT WAS PINK NAIL POLISH!

You're right, LOL! Whew, thanks for the clarification, man! I KNEW there was a reason I been feelin low on my G1 mojo lately! Oh no, the paint apps all wrong on this new mold, then! Someone call Hasbro!

headsortails wrote:You know, I'm simply looking at it like this. It's great that Botcon does the exclusives, but not everyone can attend them all. And not everyone can afford to pay the price for them once they are in the secondary market at 15 times the original cost (i say that is unfair to a collector that loves them). I know I can't. And I know there are alot of people out there who can't either. Plus think of the kids who love transformers right now. I think these should be continued to be released for them too. Someone has to keep the line going for future generations. I know this ramble may not make sense, but it's all I got for right now. Even if Hasbro releasing toys brings down the value of exclusives, it's doing nothing more than showing us how stupid we are for spending the obscene amounts of money for these things.......

Seriouosly, this is the dumbest argument out there. We should not have to bend down to the make the lowest common denominator happy. Maybe Lamorghini should sell $16,000 cars so everyone can afford them?

The big comic book publishers re-release classic issues. Owners of the much more valuable original prints don't get all teary-eyed about it. The originals, just like your exclusives, will always be more valuable, both monetarily AND as a sentimental commodity. The same can be said of G1 molds. I'm proud of my originals, but just as happy to replace the ones that got destroyed when I was was a kid with current re-releases. AKA: Get over it, repros are a fact of life!

It Is Him wrote:

craggy wrote:

chrisc4 wrote:i cant remember for the life of me, is scourge the tracker? and is cyclonus the one with his armada?

Rumble was the one that turned into a casette.

Exactly, Wheelie is the one that rhymes.

And Blurr is the one that talks too fast!

And as for the Lamborghini argument, actually, many manufacturers DO allow for the production of kit-cars, basically cheap repros of classic body-styles.

HalfOfMe wrote:The big comic book publishers re-release classic issues. Owners of the much more valuable original prints don't get all teary-eyed about it. The originals, just like your exclusives, will always be more valuable, both monetarily AND as a sentimental commodity. The same can be said of G1 molds. I'm proud of my originals, but just as happy to replace the ones that got destroyed when I was was a kid with current re-releases. AKA: Get over it, repros are a fact of life!

I'm fine with that. I'm not fine with people saying there shouldn't be exclusives because some one might not be able to afford one or they are too hard to get, exclusives are a fun part of collecting.

HalfOfMe wrote:And as for the Lamborghini argument, actually, many manufacturers DO allow for the production of kit-cars, basically cheap repros of classic body-styles.

They don't offer a cheap repro of a 570hp 12 cylinder engine now do they? There's also a different between a KO and mass producing an exclusive.

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:

Nemesis_Apoc wrote:You gotta be **** kidding me... What's the point of buying a Botcon exclusive, a toy that's only made for a specific few, when it's just going to be released at retail 3 and a half years later? I hate this.

You still have your exclusive. Hasbro's not busting into your house to steal it.

Thats what they want you to think.

GetterDragun wrote:

HalfOfMe wrote:And as for the Lamborghini argument, actually, many manufacturers DO allow for the production of kit-cars, basically cheap repros of classic body-styles.

They don't offer a cheap repro of a 570hp 12 cylinder engine now do they? There's also a different between a KO and mass producing an exclusive.

Hahaha, no, they don't. And as for people saying there SHOULDN'T BE exclusives, yeah, that's crap. Definitely part of the fun. Just like variant covers, for the sake of the comics analogy!

HalfOfMe wrote:Hahaha, no, they don't. And as for people saying there SHOULDN'T BE exclusives, yeah, that's crap. Definitely part of the fun. Just like variant covers, for the sake of the comic analogy!

Exactly. Yea this one exclusive is now a standard release. But exclusives are fun and saying there shouldn't be any is just silly.

HalfOfMe wrote:Hahaha, no, they don't. And as for people saying there SHOULDN'T BE exclusives, yeah, that's crap. Definitely part of the fun. Just like variant covers, for the sake of the comic analogy!

in this case it's more like DC Comics trade paperback collections. You buy the single issues when they first come out because you want to enjoy them, and you're not sure if, 4 years down the line they'll actually ever release a version you can walk into any bookstore or order off Amazon.

I'm just glad I can own a Classics Thundercracker for a reasonable price now. I feel for the Botconners, but they still do have an exclucive version of the guy.

GetterDragun wrote:

HalfOfMe wrote:The big comic book publishers re-release classic issues. Owners of the much more valuable original prints don't get all teary-eyed about it. The originals, just like your exclusives, will always be more valuable, both monetarily AND as a sentimental commodity. The same can be said of G1 molds. I'm proud of my originals, but just as happy to replace the ones that got destroyed when I was was a kid with current re-releases. AKA: Get over it, repros are a fact of life!

I'm fine with that. I'm not fine with people saying there shouldn't be exclusives because some one might not be able to afford one or they are too hard to get, exclusives are a fun part of collecting.

Where does he say there shouldn't be exclusives?

I'm not even saying there shouldn't be exclusives. I've actually argued for exclusives.

The issue with Thundercracker and Seekers in general is that they are mainstream characters with a mold ready to go. Hasbro could have released Thundercracker in the first Classics line with Starscream, Skywarp (stupid two-pack), and Ramjet. Because of Botcon and TFCC, Hasbro waited until after Takara to finally release the rest of the original Seekers in retail.

I'm all for exclusives that I will never purchase. People like exclusives. My issue, as well as HalfOfMe (I think) is that anyone thinks TFCC has a right to declare a mainstream character and mold as exclusive. There are other, better options. Sid Burn admitted the big mistake was TFCC and Botcon offering Seekers as exclusives to begin with because eventually Takara and later Hasbro were bound to give in to the large demand of Classics Seekers.

Sid Burn believes this sets a negative precedent. I disagree. We may never agree. But I support exclusives and as far as I can tell so does HalfOfMe.

Bradimus wrote:

GetterDragun wrote:

HalfOfMe wrote:The big comic book publishers re-release classic issues. Owners of the much more valuable original prints don't get all teary-eyed about it. The originals, just like your exclusives, will always be more valuable, both monetarily AND as a sentimental commodity. The same can be said of G1 molds. I'm proud of my originals, but just as happy to replace the ones that got destroyed when I was was a kid with current re-releases. AKA: Get over it, repros are a fact of life!

I'm fine with that. I'm not fine with people saying there shouldn't be exclusives because some one might not be able to afford one or they are too hard to get, exclusives are a fun part of collecting.

Where does he say there shouldn't be exclusives?

I'm not even saying there shouldn't be exclusives. I've actually argued for exclusives.

The issue with Thundercracker and Seekers in general is that they are mainstream characters with a mold ready to go. Hasbro could have released Thundercracker in the first Classics line with Starscream, Skywarp (stupid two-pack), and Ramjet. Because of Botcon and TFCC, Hasbro waited until after Takara to finally release the rest of the original Seekers in retail.

I'm all for exclusives that I will never purchase. People like exclusives. My issue, as well as HalfOfMe (I think) is that anyone thinks TFCC has a right to declare a mainstream character and mold as exclusive. There are other, better options. Sid Burn admitted the big mistake was TFCC and Botcon offering Seekers as exclusives to begin with because eventually Takara and later Hasbro were bound to give in to the large demand of Classics Seekers.

Sid Burn believes this sets a negative precedent. I disagree. We may never agree. But I support exclusives and as far as I can tell so does HalfOfMe.

You support them as long as they are not a mainstream character of a mold you might want. Anyone can agree with something as long as it meets their conditions.

craggy wrote:

RK_Striker_JK_5 wrote:

Nemesis_Apoc wrote:You gotta be **** kidding me... What's the point of buying a Botcon exclusive, a toy that's only made for a specific few, when it's just going to be released at retail 3 and a half years later? I hate this.

You still have your exclusive. Hasbro's not busting into your house to steal it.

Thats what they want you to think.

YOU have your exclusive that's worth more than the retail, and Hasbro is not taking it from you. I don't know what you mean by "that's what they want you to think".
I don't have any BotCon exclusives. So, should I have to travel across the country just to buy a toy that is already too expensive to begin with? Or am I less of a fan because I didn't go to BotCon, so I don't deserve a figure of that character too? YOUR figure is not the same as the retail anyway, and it is worth much more. Be happy you have it. I personally hate the existence fo BotCon exclusives to begin with, because they are usually characters I want, but when they're BotCon exclusives, they are almost impossible to obtain.

It Is Him wrote:RUINED FOREVER
You're not the first to think so, and you won't be the last.

thanks for proving the lack of forethought in anything you say. I wont debate a brick wall.
get back to me when you have something constructive to add.

You are aware that hasbro and the TFCC/Funpub are separate entities right? the latter being a very small organization made up of just one family of approx 5 people and a few of their close friends. The people that put on botcon are not some giant corporation as you seem to think.

It Is Him wrote:Boy am I pissed that SE Overkill was released. That really ruined forever the customization classes at Botcon. Now no one wants to attend those. Funpub might as well pack their bags and move on to something bigger and better.

sarcasm is the last resort of someone without an argument. If you are actually comparing the 60 people who attend the customization class, and the thousands who purchase the exclusives at the con, not to mention the thousands who order then from outside the con than I cant even have a dialogue with you.

I was simply creating an open discussion about a unique moment in TF fandom, we have never had an exclusive become so popular that it spawned a retail version (at least not to my knowledge.)

I am not trying to force anything on you. You are free to buy a barrel of retail thundercrackers, not sure why you are this hostile but again, I wont waste my time debating a person who doesn't know how to construct a point or counterpoint.

I just have this to say

IT'S A TOY

If youre a collector you have a few copies of the same mold in other colour schemes. That doesnt make yours any more or less valuable. Its the same toy, just a different colour.

People are getting worked up over a frickin paint scheme. Hasbro is losing money to bootleggers, and theyve waited a long time before resorting to this. Fair play to them. It doesnt devalue a limited edition model at all, just means they wont sell for such insane prices on ebay so much.

Was megatron the one that sounded like he smoked 50 cygars a day?

Stumpybot wrote:I just have this to say

IT'S A TOY

If youre a collector you have a few copies of the same mold in other colour schemes. That doesnt make yours any more or less valuable. Its the same toy, just a different colour.

totally valid, I dont know why a few posters felt the need to jump up and down in anger over my post.

I never flamed anyone for buying this cracker, only wanted to debate the effect of something that hasnt happened in the fandom before.

Stumpybot wrote:I just have this to say

IT'S A TOY

If youre a collector you have a few copies of the same mold in other colour schemes. That doesnt make yours any more or less valuable. Its the same toy, just a different colour.

People are getting worked up over a frickin paint scheme. Hasbro is losing money to bootleggers, and theyve waited a long time before resorting to this. Fair play to them. It doesnt devalue a limited edition model at all, just means they wont sell for such insane prices on ebay so much.

Was megatron the one that sounded like he smoked 50 cygars a day?

That's a good point. People are in support of this general release (which is fine), but many of those were the same people who were buying the knockoffs. If you are going to be a "collector" then at least buy a legitimate product.