Transformers Titans Return Trypticon Promo Clip and Philippines Sighting

ALREADY SIGHTED AND AVAILABLE IN ASIA RETAILS?! (PH)

Yes it hurts my wallet very much

Albatross250 wrote:ALREADY SIGHTED AND AVAILABLE IN ASIA RETAILS?! (PH)

Yes it hurts my wallet very much

whaa....? the Takara version?

A thought - the spring in the hip rotation joints. Is it possible that you have to pull the hip outward slightly in order to rotate them safely? And that the spring was meant to pull them back into place once released? That's what I might do if I wanted to engineer a heavy figure that would have a mechanism that allowed for hip rotation, and yet have them lock in place afterwards to prevent slippage...

Ravage XK wrote:Well this is a huge disappointment. You'd think that QC would have caught this issue.

Is this a deal breaker for anyone?

Hell yes it is!!!

I really hope the guys at Takara are looking at what's going on. Look the bottom line is I don't fork out my hard earned money on TFs especially expensive ones to break apart due QC BS... . I also don't wish to have to open things up and fart around with parts, too much money is involved for me to have to do that. There may be those who may enjoy this or don't mind but not me.

So unless can help rectify things it pains me to say that I will not be getting Trypticon...'nuff said!

We could also get a running change. Stuff like this happens all the time, right?

I have a pre order and unless there is a fix or you do have to pull the legs to move them I'm thinking of cancelling.

OH, COME ON!

I was all excited about Tryppy coming soon and this has to pop up.

Stuartmaximus wrote:whaa....? the Takara version?

No, the Hasbro version. He wrote PH for philipines, so that can only mean Hasbro version since the takara version only sells in Japan.

Kurona wrote:We could also get a running change. Stuff like this happens all the time, right?

Yes it does. More reason for me to wait till after christmas for this toy.

william-james88 wrote:

Stuartmaximus wrote:whaa....? the Takara version?

No, the Hasbro version. He wrote PH for philipines, so that can only mean Hasbro version since the takara version only sells in Japan.

Kurona wrote:We could also get a running change. Stuff like this happens all the time, right?

Yes it does. More reason for me to wait till after christmas for this toy.

After Christmas...?

Nemesis Destron wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Stuartmaximus wrote:whaa....? the Takara version?

No, the Hasbro version. He wrote PH for philipines, so that can only mean Hasbro version since the takara version only sells in Japan.

Kurona wrote:We could also get a running change. Stuff like this happens all the time, right?

Yes it does. More reason for me to wait till after christmas for this toy.

After Christmas...?

Yup, any money I get at christmas will be going towards what I hope is an on sale and fixed second run Trypticon

william-james88 wrote:

Nemesis Destron wrote:

william-james88 wrote:

Stuartmaximus wrote:whaa....? the Takara version?

No, the Hasbro version. He wrote PH for philipines, so that can only mean Hasbro version since the takara version only sells in Japan.

Kurona wrote:We could also get a running change. Stuff like this happens all the time, right?

Yes it does. More reason for me to wait till after christmas for this toy.

After Christmas...?

Yup, any money I get at christmas will be going towards what I hope is an on sale and fixed second run Trypticon

Riiiiight-got it.

I'll wait for someone else to do a full explanation of the problem before I go into panic mode.

Cobotron wrote:I'll wait for someone else to do a full explanation of the problem before I go into panic mode.

Qwan did a page back.

The long and the short of it is that the springs in the ratchet joints are really strong, to the point they could lock up. If excessive force is applied to get it to move again when that happens, the internal structure of joint gets wrecked to heavens due to the springs not budging. By the by, they're BIG, like the width of an earthworm.

Can anyone confirm my suspicion that users are supposed to pull the hip joints outward slightly when rotating, so the plastic ratchets have clearance of each other? And the spring pulls the hips back in when released?

Trypticon 3rd party add on:

I'm really hoping it's something that can be easily resolved, as far as his hips go. I'd be disappointed but ok with his legs only being able to safely rotate forwards as the video review had said, if the hips do indeed need to be angled out to release tension, or if Qwan's spring adjustment works well. I've just been ready for this figure since the poll took place and I don't want to be disappointed because of QC xD

DeathReviews wrote:Can anyone confirm my suspicion that users are supposed to pull the hip joints outward slightly when rotating, so the plastic ratchets have clearance of each other? And the spring pulls the hips back in when released?

I can confirm that this is not the case. The springs aren't attached to anything so they wouldn't be able to pull anything together, and the rotation for the hips (basically a fully-enclosed giant mushroom peg with a ratchet inside) doesn't allow any leeway whatsoever for pulling the hips outward. The spring is definitely designed to be super-compressed and push outward, rather than extend and pull inward.
So sadly, that design isn't the case here - although I agree it would probably work quite well for a large figure like this!

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:By the by, they're BIG, like the width of an earthworm.

Looking back that was a bit of an exaggeration on my part; that was back when I was just 'reviewing' the figure for fun (the issue hadn't made itself known yet) and the description was more of a comedy decision than an accuracy one. They are seriously big though, way more so than I think any other spring I've seen, certainly on a toy. And really sturdy too; I put one under the corner of my bed for an hour or so to try and compress it down (which I'd prefer over cutting them, if possible) and it made literally no difference whatsoever.

I finally got around to taking a photo of them, actually. Here they are, with Krok for size reference (he was the only decent comparison I had on me) - Titan Masters can fit inside them. Yeah that's big.

Qwan wrote:I can confirm that this is not the case. The springs aren't attached to anything so they wouldn't be able to pull anything together, and the rotation for the hips (basically a fully-enclosed giant mushroom peg with a ratchet inside) doesn't allow any leeway whatsoever for pulling the hips outward. The spring is definitely designed to be super-compressed and push outward, rather than extend and pull inward.
So sadly, that design isn't the case here - although I agree it would probably work quite well for a large figure like this!

Alas. Well, I will likely sharpen the sickle and do some surgery on my Trypticon in that case. I certainly don't want to wind up with a mess of twisted plastic inside the legs.

The overdone hip springs don't reek of bad QC, but rather poorly thought out QA. Overcompensating for a fix to the point of creating a new problem hurts to read about.

Didn't they learn anything from Unique Toys Siegfried?

I'm trying to work out what sort of replacement springs a person would need to buy. I'm not sure shortening the spring is the best solution, but it is a solution, if done right. I found a thread about springs used in guns, and the discussion highlights how complicated the math is.

Apparently, cutting coils off of a spring technically makes the spring stronger, because the strength of the spring is relative to its own length. If it takes x amount of force to compress a spring to its solid height, after reducing the free length of the spring, it will take more force to compress it to its solid height, because you have less leverage, and you have to compress it further to reach its solid height. I tried to follow the math, but it was difficult.

As best I understand it, if you compress a 10" spring by 4" (10"-4" = 6") you're compressing it by 40%. If you reduce the free length of the spring by 2" (10"-2"= 8") and then compress your cut down spring by 4" (8"-4"), you're compressing it by 50%. In both cases, you're compressing it over the same distance (4"), but the amount of compression involved increases (from 40% to 50%) as you shorten the spring.

However, that's considering the free length vs the working length. In the toy, the springs aren't at their free length by default, they are at their installed length, which makes things different - by reducing the number of coils in the spring, while keeping the installed length constant, you are (just as intuition would dictate) reducing the spring's 'strength', and therefore reducing the pressure on the joint when the toy is at rest.

Let's say the installed length is 1.0", and the teeth on the ratchet are 0.1" deep. If the spring's free length is 1.5", the installed length of 1.0" has the spring at 33% compression, and the working length, the length of the spring when the teeth are 'on edge', has the spring at 40% compression. The joint, of course, is under more strain when the teeth are on edge - that's what pushes them into place, and provides resistance to the joint's rotation.

Now, cut the spring down a bit to 1.25". Keeping everything else the same, the spring is now only compressed by 20% when the teeth are together, and 28% when on edge. The joint is under much less strain in both positions, and depending on how heavy Trypticon's upper-body is, he may face-plant. Obviously, if you mess up and cut the free length down to less than the installed length, he will almost definitely be permanently screwed up.

But here's the really weird part that confuses the heck out of me. Leaving the installed length and the working length the same means that, turning the ratchet requires a 0.1" compression from 1.0" to 0.9". Now, for the 1.5" spring, that 0.1" change is a 6.67% change in compression, but for the 1.25" spring, that's an 8% change in compression as the ratchet's teeth move across each other. So, if you cut the spring down, the static compression of spring is decreased, but the change in compression when the joint turns is increased.

I'm a psychologist, not an engineer, so I have no idea what the implications of that are for the torque placed on those plastic tabs when the leg is turned. I assume that it wouldn't be a problem, but I'm not 100% confident. The other problem is that the spring has 'closed coils' at each end, and cutting a closed coil off one end of the spring may not have the outcome that would be expected; for one thing the cut end of the spring may drag across the plastic like a needle on a record player.

If, hypothetically, anyone decides to replace their springs, rather than shorten them, here are the things I think you need to keep in mind:

Dimensions that must be the same as the vanilla springs used in Trypticon:

Interior Diameter - Must be bigger than whatever slips through it.
Outside Diameter - Must be smaller than whatever the spring fits in.
Installed Length - Must be less than the Free Length of the replacement spring.
Working Length - Must be more than the Solid Height of the replacement spring.

Changing these dimensions may screw up the functionality of the toy, or the springs may simply not fit inside the joint.

Dimensions that can be shortened to reduce spring strength:
Free Length - Length of the spring outside of the mechanism, with no pressure on it.
Solid Height - Length of the spring outside of the mechanism, when pressed as far as it can go.

Shortening the spring will make it weaker, but if you shorten it past its Installed Length the toy will become floppy. If you shorten it past its Working Length, the spring will no longer function at all.

Variables requiring completely new springs:
Wire Material - I think softer metals should be weaker.
Wire Diameter - Thinner wire will be weaker.

I don't know how a thinner/softer spring will hold up over time - if the toy is stored/displayed with the springs compressed to their working length, the springs may need to be replaced again in the future.

Caelus wrote:[INCREDIBLY SMART STUFF]

Wow, that is... really impressive research, man. It's interesting to read about all the factors that have to go into deciding spring length, strength, working length etc. to get the desired result. It's crazy! (Makes me feel a lot less sure that just cutting down the springs will solve the problem, except...)


Last night I finally tried my proposed solution of cutting the springs (on the not-yet-destroyed hip of my Trypticon) and it seems to have worked pretty well after all! I'll admit I was worried in particular about

Caelus wrote:cutting a closed coil off one end of the spring may not have the outcome that would be expected; for one thing the cut end of the spring may drag across the plastic like a needle on a record player.

for exactly that reason (and since I wasn't too sure what it'd do to the mechanism if one end wasn't sitting flat), but surprisingly it doesn't seem to be a problem so far - though admittedly I only tested it for a few minutes.

I'll try and get a tutorial up later today (I've already got the photos taken, but it's hard to upload them at work) but for now, I'll say that it seems like about half the original length is a fairly good balance - it doesn't feel like there's any dangerous pressure but there are still clear ratchet points, though they're now more of a guideline than they are real locking points. In fact they still have enough hold that I got Trypticon standing both straight and in an action pose, unassisted, with half a spring installed in his left hip and no ratchet at all in the right (and no added friction to the joints or anything). I'll reconfirm how well this works tonight once I've exchanged the broken Tryp for a new one and gone through the process on that one (and I wouldn't recommend anyone do this to theirs until I can confirm that this works and holds up fine), but it seems quite promising so far.

Qwan; if I may ask, is the wire too strong to bend with needle nose pliers? Thanks!

Curious to see the tutorial for cutting the springs. Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention!

Caelus wrote:Qwan; if I may ask, is the wire too strong to bend with needle nose pliers? Thanks!

I wouldn't say it's too strong to do so, but it's definitely strong enough to be plenty difficult. I think maybe the spring bent outward a tiny bit while I was cutting it? But on the other hand, I put one of the springs under the corner of my bed for like an hour to try and compress it, and it made exactly zero difference. I guess that makes some sense when you think that the whole point of these springs (and most springs I guess) is to be flexible without actually being bendable, so to speak.

nilocomic wrote:Curious to see the tutorial for cutting the springs. Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention!

No problem, and thank you! I've relied on figure mods (be they life-saving or just ease-of-use things) so often in the past, that I figured now I have the chance I should try and be part of the solution for once.

(Speaking of, I'm starting to think maybe I should make my own thread for the full tutorial. I'll obviously give a quick-if-functional run-down here, but with all the explanation and images I'm planning to include, I don't want to clog up this thread too much with a gigantic planet-eating post. Chances are I'll run through the process in brief, then include a link to the new thread for anyone who wants a more detailed explanation of how I did it. Either way, expect that pretty soon probably - I have my new Trypticon, I've cut his springs down to half size, and though he's a tiny bit wobblier now he also feels significantly less like a ticking time bomb. )

Qwan, I think you should put your tutorial right here. this is the place to be for all things Trypticon and, it will benefit everyone, even lurkers who may be looking for answers to the problem.

Qwan wrote:(Speaking of, I'm starting to think maybe I should make my own thread for the full tutorial. I'll obviously give a quick-if-functional run-down here, but with all the explanation and images I'm planning to include, I don't want to clog up this thread too much with a gigantic planet-eating post. Chances are I'll run through the process in brief, then include a link to the new thread for anyone who wants a more detailed explanation of how I did it. Either way, expect that pretty soon probably - I have my new Trypticon, I've cut his springs down to half size, and though he's a tiny bit wobblier now he also feels significantly less like a ticking time bomb. )

It's the sort of thing we'd like to News so everyone knows what to expect when he gets a broader release.

Are you able to give me measurements of the new cut down spring? I'll have a look and see if we have something similar in stock or if we can get something similar in.

Burn wrote:

Qwan wrote:(Speaking of, I'm starting to think maybe I should make my own thread for the full tutorial. I'll obviously give a quick-if-functional run-down here, but with all the explanation and images I'm planning to include, I don't want to clog up this thread too much with a gigantic planet-eating post. Chances are I'll run through the process in brief, then include a link to the new thread for anyone who wants a more detailed explanation of how I did it. Either way, expect that pretty soon probably - I have my new Trypticon, I've cut his springs down to half size, and though he's a tiny bit wobblier now he also feels significantly less like a ticking time bomb. )

It's the sort of thing we'd like to News so everyone knows what to expect when he gets a broader release,.

Yes.

Cobotron wrote:Qwan, I think you should put your tutorial right here. this is the place to be for all things Trypticon and, it will benefit everyone, even lurkers who may be looking for answers to the problem.

And yes.

Qwan wrote:

Caelus wrote:Qwan; if I may ask, is the wire too strong to bend with needle nose pliers? Thanks!

I wouldn't say it's too strong to do so, but it's definitely strong enough to be plenty difficult. I think maybe the spring bent outward a tiny bit while I was cutting it? But on the other hand, I put one of the springs under the corner of my bed for like an hour to try and compress it, and it made exactly zero difference. I guess that makes some sense when you think that the whole point of these springs (and most springs I guess) is to be flexible without actually being bendable, so to speak.

It may not be possible then, but I was going to suggest bending the cut end back on itself in a tight loop - very tight, like grip it with the pliers and then wrap the wire around the tip of the pliers. Not sure if that would really impact anything, anyway, though.

What happens if I just don't do anything to the leg

Point gotten; I'll post it here as soon as I've got it all sorted out! (I keep pushing it back to make sure I cover as much as possible, including potential optional steps which I myself haven't done yet )

Burn wrote:Are you able to give me measurements of the new cut down spring? I'll have a look and see if we have something similar in stock or if we can get something similar in.

Sure thing! The way I've cut the springs they're exactly half the length of the original, but the ratchets feel like they could deal with (maybe even benefit from?) an extra millimeter or two of height so there's a bit of leeway with that dimension, depending how strong one still wants the ratchet to be. The dimensions of the cut-down spring are as follows:

Height: 16.5-17mm; this encompasses exactly two full coils including one coil for the flat 'base' (original spring height just over 33mm inc. 2 full 'base' coils, 1 on each end)
Spring diameter (from one side of the coil to the other): 25mm
Thickness: just over 1mm (maybe 1.25-ish?)
Sturdiness: very

Caelus wrote:I was going to suggest bending the cut end back on itself in a tight loop - very tight, like grip it with the pliers and then wrap the wire around the tip of the pliers. Not sure if that would really impact anything, anyway, though.

Yeah, it'd definitely be quite tough to bend it on that small a scale. It doesn't seem like having the 'sharp' end just sticking out is harming the mechanism in any way on mine so far, but I've been thinking about adding a "buffer layer" of cardboard between plastic and spring, to prevent scratching and add a little more strength to the joint. (That's actually the part of the guide that I'm working on right now, and the last (fingers crossed) bit left for me to do.)

Rainmaker wrote:What happens if I just don't do anything to the leg

It explodes eventually (inevitably) wrecks itself due to the strength of the ratchet. When you get your Trypticon, if you get it, you'll definitely want to do something to the hip joints - even if it's just taking the ratchets out and turning them into strong friction joints - because otherwise, at this point, it's basically guaranteed that you will have a broken Trypticon within a few days.

Qwan wrote:

Height: 16.5-17mm; this encompasses exactly two full coils including one coil for the flat 'base' (original spring height just over 33mm inc. 2 full 'base' coils, 1 on each end)
Spring diameter (from one side of the coil to the other): 25mm
Thickness: just over 1mm (maybe 1.25-ish?)
Sturdiness: very

Sweet! I'll take this to the guys tomorrow.

Qwan wrote:

Rainmaker wrote:What happens if I just don't do anything to the leg

It explodes eventually (inevitably) wrecks itself due to the strength of the ratchet. When you get your Trypticon, if you get it, you'll definitely want to do something to the hip joints - even if it's just taking the ratchets out and turning them into strong friction joints - because otherwise, at this point, it's basically guaranteed that you will have a broken Trypticon within a few days.

What if you don't actually transform him? What if you just put him straight on display? Will that still be a problem or is it only if you move the legs?

Burn wrote:

Qwan wrote:

Rainmaker wrote:What happens if I just don't do anything to the leg

It explodes eventually (inevitably) wrecks itself due to the strength of the ratchet. When you get your Trypticon, if you get it, you'll definitely want to do something to the hip joints - even if it's just taking the ratchets out and turning them into strong friction joints - because otherwise, at this point, it's basically guaranteed that you will have a broken Trypticon within a few days.

What if you don't actually transform him? What if you just put him straight on display? Will that still be a problem or is it only if you move the legs?

I don't think that'd be a problem; in fact, if you're only ever going to display Trypticon in one pose you might as well leave the springs in (because there is no way they'll move in their default configuration, so no danger of him ever overbalancing at the hips). The issue as I interpret it will only arise when the mechanism is forced to actually function - which, admittedly, is the whole point of a mechanism in the first place.



Okay, so! I've finally gotten around to doing this thing. Time to run through the process of making your very own Trypticon not destroy itself within 48 hours!

---

Before I start the 'tutorial', so to speak, perhaps a little background is in order. Titans Return Trypticon's hip ratchets are, thanks to the incredible size and strength of the ratchets within, self-destructively strong (such that the inner mechanisms of the ratchet will wreck themselves beyond repair if the hips are left unmodded, and moved back and forth even a few times). One way to remedy this is to take apart the hips and simply remove the springs from the ratchets, leaving them as friction joints. If you're like me though and feel the need to still have ratchets to some degree, I'll be running you through the process of cutting the springs down to size - that way the hips can still ratchet softly (and hold the figure up perfectly well!) without being nearly strong enough to pose any danger to the integrity of their own inner workings.

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Stage 1 of the repair is just opening up the hips. The first thing you'll want to do is take each of Trypticon's legs back out of the locking point on his body that you would have put them in when you first 'assembled' him out of the package. (Or, if you're doing this straight away out of the box, no need! They're already pre-detached for you.)


These are all the tools you should need for this modification. One screwdriver (#1 or #2 seems to work well for all screws involved in this mod, whatever those numbers mean for screwdriver size); one small knife of any kind (I just used my trusty pocket-knife, but anything sharper than 'blunt' will work well enough); and one pair of wire cutters (preferably not as rusty as mine are, though again it's not like you need uber-professional tools).


Unscrew the two screws (one on each side) holding the teal 'bracket' to the black plastic chunk of the hip.


Unscrew the third, sunken screw holding the two halves of the teal bracket together.


And, split the two halves apart and remove them.


Unscrew the two screws (one on top, one on the bottom, both on the same side) holding the two halves of black plastic chunk together.


Split the two halves and remove them. When you're doing this initially, be aware that the springwill launch out at you and the two other pieces of the ratchet will attempt to fly away. Pry these black plastic pieces apart with caution, preferably holding down the inner ratchet mechanism after you remove one half, and gently releasing your hold once you've removed the other.



Remove the top half of the ratchet, then the bottom half. Remove the spring from the ratchet housing.



Use the wire-cutters to cut one of the springs exactly in half. The halfway point on the spring lines up vertically with both 'ends' of the spring, so you can tell pretty easily where to cut.
(You should only need to modify one of Trypticon's springs in order to get his hips functioning well, and you can just leave the other off to the side. Though if you desire slightly more pressure on the ratchets than half a spring would provide, you can of course cut each spring just past halfway and use those pieces instead.)

---


Now, let's take a break from the spring and deal with the other half of the issue here! The little cross-shaped piece of plastic, that's meant to keep the inner half of the ratchet mechanism from rotating, actually is the cause of another connected issue that I've identified. See, that ratchet piece is meant to be able to slide up and down easily on that cross, but it's just a tiny bit too thick, which adds even more difficulty to turning the ratchet.

Since we've cut down the spring, that's not going to be an issue any more, but it still causes a different problem - now that the pressure from the spring is much weaker, it's unable to overcome the friction against this cross piece and the inner ratchet-piece will get stuck inside its housing, making the ratchet hard to use. So, what to do then except shave it down?


Take your knife and shave down every surface on the cross (except the top surface), just a little. Now luckily the plastic it's made of is super soft (which of course, is part of the cause of this whole problem in the first place), so it's really easy to cut and/or shave. To test and make sure it works, push the inner ratchet piece (and the newly-cut spring inside) into its housing and push it down, just a little bit - if it springs back into place, you've shaved it down enough; if not, pull it back out with some pliers or something and shave that cross down a little more!


(Just to show you how soft the plastic is on this part, these marks were made just by holding the pocket-knife in place to take that photo. So, yeah.)

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Additionally, if you want to add some more strength to the newly-weakened joint (though these half-strength ratchets will hold well enough to keep Trypticon standing and posed), you have two options:


1. Add a little bit of thickening to the contact points of the hip-joint's swivel. In this image I've just put a layer of electrical tape around the contact point, which does add quite a lot more friction! (In fact, it does so to the point where it pretty much overpowers the new weaker ratchet, so I personally chose not to use this. However if it's still up your alley, that's all good for you!)




2. Add an additional layer or two under the ratchet spring. For example I took a circle of cardboard, cut some room in it for it to fit over the plastic cross in the ratchet housing, and put it in place under the spring. Theoretically it should reduce the space that the spring has to expand, strengthening it ever-so-slightly, though I've not noticed much difference with the single layer of cardboard I've been using myself. Regardless it doesn't cause a detriment, and also prevents the sharper 'cut' end of the springs from scratching the inner plastic of the housing, so I'd recommend doing this.

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Now, back to the ratchet joint! That's right, it's time to reconstruct it.


Put the half-spring back in the inner ratchet piece - personally I put the flat end of the spring inside the ratchet piece, leaving the sharper end out (where the plastic housing can be protected by a layer of cardboard, nudge nudge), but there's no real 'right' way around to put it so make your own decision.


Put the inner ratchet piece back into its housing, with the spring in between. (Ignore the electrical tape: this photo is a holdover from an earlier draft of the modifications, but the rest of it gets the point across well enough that I can't be bothered retaking).


Outer ratchet piece back on. Flat parts of the piece vertical (i.e. a hypothetical line drawn between the two flat parts should be perpendicular to the soles of Trypticon's feet).




As you put the two halves of the plastic chunk back together, make sure the half with the screw-holes (as pictured) faces the back of the leg. This actually does make a structural difference, so be sure the right piece is on the right side. Screw the chunk back together. (The screws you'll need to use, if you haven't kept track, are the slightly smaller pair without the 'brim' round the edge.)




Same as the previous step, as you reconstruct the teal bracket make sure the side with the screw-hole faces the back of the leg (same direction as the screw-holes on the black chunk). Screw it back together (with the odd screw out if you need to know, it's the only one that doesn't have a pair), then put the last two screws in to hold it to the leg.

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And there you have it! Reattach those legs to your Trypticon and enjoy your new, slightly more wobbly but still functional and significantly less prone-to-self-destruction Trypticon! Obviously there are a few steps in here that can be played with a little bit to get the ratchet strength exactly as you desire, but as a baseline, exactly half a spring in each ratchet joint (with or without a layer of cardboard) works perfectly well enough to sustain posing an transformation without endangering the ratchet joints. Best of luck, and have fun with your newly-safe-to-play-with Trypticon!


(Phew, it's now half-past-midnight by this point. I really should've just written this out tomorrow. Probably gonna come back and edit it a bit when I'm less over-tired, to make sure it makes sense, but I think it seems good enough for now. If there's anything anyone needs/wants clarified or explained further, let me know and I'll do my best to elaborate at some point tomorrow!)

That was very well done.

I'm still not certain I'm confident enough in myself to commit to cutting down the stock springs, but if I find replacement springs, I'll definitely be using that reference for disassembling and reassembling the mechanism.

With Titans Return Trypticon starting to make its way to store shelves in places like Australia, we have heard word that Trypticon himself is subject to some very scary and potentially bad dino-hips. Basically, his hips are built up so well with the springs and stuff that the plastic cannot take it, and simply spreading his legs or transforming him can damage him.

With this in mind, we bring to you a tutorial from Seibertronian Qwan, who has an awesome picture heavy procedure for how you can prevent your Trypticon from losing his hips! Check it out below, and let us know if this was useful.

Qwan wrote:Okay, so! I've finally gotten around to doing this thing. Time to run through the process of making your very own Trypticon not destroy itself within 48 hours!

---

Before I start the 'tutorial', so to speak, perhaps a little background is in order. Titans Return Trypticon's hip ratchets are, thanks to the incredible size and strength of the ratchets within, self-destructively strong (such that the inner mechanisms of the ratchet will wreck themselves beyond repair if the hips are left unmodded, and moved back and forth even a few times). One way to remedy this is to take apart the hips and simply remove the springs from the ratchets, leaving them as friction joints. If you're like me though and feel the need to still have ratchets to some degree, I'll be running you through the process of cutting the springs down to size - that way the hips can still ratchet softly (and hold the figure up perfectly well!) without being nearly strong enough to pose any danger to the integrity of their own inner workings.

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Stage 1 of the repair is just opening up the hips. The first thing you'll want to do is take each of Trypticon's legs back out of the locking point on his body that you would have put them in when you first 'assembled' him out of the package. (Or, if you're doing this straight away out of the box, no need! They're already pre-detached for you.)



These are all the tools you should need for this modification. One screwdriver (#1 or #2 seems to work well for all screws involved in this mod, whatever those numbers mean for screwdriver size); one small knife of any kind (I just used my trusty pocket-knife, but anything sharper than 'blunt' will work well enough); and one pair of wire cutters (preferably not as rusty as mine are, though again it's not like you need uber-professional tools).



Unscrew the two screws (one on each side) holding the teal 'bracket' to the black plastic chunk of the hip.



Unscrew the third, sunken screw holding the two halves of the teal bracket together.



And, split the two halves apart and remove them.



Unscrew the two screws (one on top, one on the bottom, both on the same side) holding the two halves of black plastic chunk together.



Split the two halves and remove them. When you're doing this initially, be aware that the springwill launch out at you and the two other pieces of the ratchet will attempt to fly away. Pry these black plastic pieces apart with caution, preferably holding down the inner ratchet mechanism after you remove one half, and gently releasing your hold once you've removed the other.





Remove the top half of the ratchet, then the bottom half. Remove the spring from the ratchet housing.





Use the wire-cutters to cut one of the springs exactly in half. The halfway point on the spring lines up vertically with both 'ends' of the spring, so you can tell pretty easily where to cut.
(You should only need to modify one of Trypticon's springs in order to get his hips functioning well, and you can just leave the other off to the side. Though if you desire slightly more pressure on the ratchets than half a spring would provide, you can of course cut each spring just past halfway and use those pieces instead.)

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Now, let's take a break from the spring and deal with the other half of the issue here! The little cross-shaped piece of plastic, that's meant to keep the inner half of the ratchet mechanism from rotating, actually is the cause of another connected issue that I've identified. See, that ratchet piece is meant to be able to slide up and down easily on that cross, but it's just a tiny bit too thick, which adds even more difficulty to turning the ratchet.

Since we've cut down the spring, that's not going to be an issue any more, but it still causes a different problem - now that the pressure from the spring is much weaker, it's unable to overcome the friction against this cross piece and the inner ratchet-piece will get stuck inside its housing, making the ratchet hard to use. So, what to do then except shave it down?



Take your knife and shave down every surface on the cross (except the top surface), just a little. Now luckily the plastic it's made of is super soft (which of course, is part of the cause of this whole problem in the first place), so it's really easy to cut and/or shave. To test and make sure it works, push the inner ratchet piece (and the newly-cut spring inside) into its housing and push it down, just a little bit - if it springs back into place, you've shaved it down enough; if not, pull it back out with some pliers or something and shave that cross down a little more!



(Just to show you how soft the plastic is on this part, these marks were made just by holding the pocket-knife in place to take that photo. So, yeah.)

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Additionally, if you want to add some more strength to the newly-weakened joint (though these half-strength ratchets will hold well enough to keep Trypticon standing and posed), you have two options:



1. Add a little bit of thickening to the contact points of the hip-joint's swivel. In this image I've just put a layer of electrical tape around the contact point, which does add quite a lot more friction! (In fact, it does so to the point where it pretty much overpowers the new weaker ratchet, so I personally chose not to use this. However if it's still up your alley, that's all good for you!)







2. Add an additional layer or two under the ratchet spring. For example I took a circle of cardboard, cut some room in it for it to fit over the plastic cross in the ratchet housing, and put it in place under the spring. Theoretically it should reduce the space that the spring has to expand, strengthening it ever-so-slightly, though I've not noticed much difference with the single layer of cardboard I've been using myself. Regardless it doesn't cause a detriment, and also prevents the sharper 'cut' end of the springs from scratching the inner plastic of the housing, so I'd recommend doing this.

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Now, back to the ratchet joint! That's right, it's time to reconstruct it.



Put the half-spring back in the inner ratchet piece - personally I put the flat end of the spring inside the ratchet piece, leaving the sharper end out (where the plastic housing can be protected by a layer of cardboard, nudge nudge), but there's no real 'right' way around to put it so make your own decision.



Put the inner ratchet piece back into its housing, with the spring in between. (Ignore the electrical tape: this photo is a holdover from an earlier draft of the modifications, but the rest of it gets the point across well enough that I can't be bothered retaking).



Outer ratchet piece back on. Flat parts of the piece vertical (i.e. a hypothetical line drawn between the two flat parts should be perpendicular to the soles of Trypticon's feet).







As you put the two halves of the plastic chunk back together, make sure the half with the screw-holes (as pictured) faces the back of the leg. This actually does make a structural difference, so be sure the right piece is on the right side. Screw the chunk back together. (The screws you'll need to use, if you haven't kept track, are the slightly smaller pair without the 'brim' round the edge.)







Same as the previous step, as you reconstruct the teal bracket make sure the side with the screw-hole faces the back of the leg (same direction as the screw-holes on the black chunk). Screw it back together (with the odd screw out if you need to know, it's the only one that doesn't have a pair), then put the last two screws in to hold it to the leg.

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And there you have it! Reattach those legs to your Trypticon and enjoy your new, slightly more wobbly but still functional and significantly less prone-to-self-destruction Trypticon! Obviously there are a few steps in here that can be played with a little bit to get the ratchet strength exactly as you desire, but as a baseline, exactly half a spring in each ratchet joint (with or without a layer of cardboard) works perfectly well enough to sustain posing an transformation without endangering the ratchet joints. Best of luck, and have fun with your newly-safe-to-play-with Trypticon!


(Phew, it's now half-past-midnight by this point. I really should've just written this out tomorrow. Probably gonna come back and edit it a bit when I'm less over-tired, to make sure it makes sense, but I think it seems good enough for now. If there's anything anyone needs/wants clarified or explained further, let me know and I'll do my best to elaborate at some point tomorrow!)

Burn wrote:

Qwan wrote:(Speaking of, I'm starting to think maybe I should make my own thread for the full tutorial. I'll obviously give a quick-if-functional run-down here, but with all the explanation and images I'm planning to include, I don't want to clog up this thread too much with a gigantic planet-eating post. Chances are I'll run through the process in brief, then include a link to the new thread for anyone who wants a more detailed explanation of how I did it. Either way, expect that pretty soon probably - I have my new Trypticon, I've cut his springs down to half size, and though he's a tiny bit wobblier now he also feels significantly less like a ticking time bomb. )

It's the sort of thing we'd like to News so everyone knows what to expect when he gets a broader release.

Are you able to give me measurements of the new cut down spring? I'll have a look and see if we have something similar in stock or if we can get something similar in.

Eh

do you own or run a store (just in case anyone else on here reads that & wants to order springs from you?)

The Irony of this is that it's the opposite of what is needed to make the Previous two more functional.

I wonder if you can simply swap the springs over between Fortress Maximus and Trypticon's leg to benefit them both ?

I think it kinda sucks that we spend that kind of money and have to do any kind of modifications at all

Surely Hasbro has some robot kid or Man-child tester that would've figured this out BEFORE putting it into production??

That's just me...

This hip repair tutorial will come in handy, thanks. I was just going to slice it open with my sickle...

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Thanks for tip for fixing his problem

Can we get some reports of other people having kamikaze Trypticons? I want to know if this is a widespread issue, a few early production sets, or an Australian bad egg.

zatara1701 wrote:I think it kinda sucks that we spend that kind of money and have to do any kind of modifications at all

That's just me...

Thank you!!!

Hopefully there are persons who can dig into the issue and provide us with functional solutions to manufacturing problems.
I totally agree with the "How is it that I need to fix a toy right out of the box before I can use it, with all the money I've spent" comment.
I've already done this with MP-36 Megatron, and it left a bitter taste in my mouth (can't imagine what it would have been if I had broken it).
It never happened with any of my Soul of Chogokin bots.

I hope this issue is fixed before it hits the states.

Great to see there's a way to fix this. However...
INCOMING RANT
...the fact a product this expensive will literally destroy itself through NORMAL OPERATION without fairly heavy modification is absolutely unacceptable. Not just disappointing or irritating, this is flat-out unforgivable. It's bad enough with Deluxes, but with a Titan class figure? This sh!t shouldn't make it past the prototyping stage. The fact it seems to stem from horrendously cheap and rubbish plastic isn't exactly promising either. Hasbro should be ashamed.

My advice would be not to buy this figure, especially not at full price. Either wait for it to go on clearance (when hopefully there will be pre-manufactured 3P replacement parts available) or spend the extra cash on a 3P alternative. This kind of quality on a product that costs this much is not acceptable and Hasbro needs to learn that. Sadly, it seems the only way to teach them not to make sh!tty products is to not buy those products.

Of course they'll probably go "Oh, well they obviously don't want Titans anymore seeing as they aren't selling" but you know what? If this is the sort of crap we're gonna get given under the Titan class label, I'm fine with that. Hopefully the 3Ps will fill the void as they usually do- MakeToys' Metroplex, whilst smaller, is infinitely better than the official version, so maybe they'll do a decent Trypticon.

Black Hat wrote:Great to see there's a way to fix this. However...
INCOMING RANT
...the fact a product this expensive will literally destroy itself through NORMAL OPERATION without fairly heavy modification is absolutely unacceptable. Not just disappointing or irritating, this is flat-out unforgivable. It's bad enough with Deluxes, but with a Titan class figure? This sh!t shouldn't make it past the prototyping stage. The fact it seems to stem from horrendously cheap and rubbish plastic isn't exactly promising either. Hasbro should be ashamed.

My advice would be not to buy this figure, especially not at full price. Either wait for it to go on clearance (when hopefully there will be pre-manufactured 3P replacement parts available) or spend the extra cash on a 3P alternative. This kind of quality on a product that costs this much is not acceptable and Hasbro needs to learn that. Sadly, it seems the only way to teach them not to make sh!tty products is to not buy those products.

Of course they'll probably go "Oh, well they obviously don't want Titans anymore seeing as they aren't selling" but you know what? If this is the sort of crap we're gonna get given under the Titan class label, I'm fine with that. Hopefully the 3Ps will fill the void as they usually do- MakeToys' Metroplex, whilst smaller, is infinitely better than the official version, so maybe they'll do a decent Trypticon.

Whoah, there, buddy...
Maybe it's best to hold your "RANT" off until there's more than a single person on the planet reporting this issue. It's certainly good to know that someone's experienced this, but that hardly qualifies as proof that it's some wide-spread problem. Instructing everyone not to buy a figure based on a poor experience from one single individual who owns it is WAY premature and pretty alarmist. There have been plenty of issues with toys like this in the past that did not end up being as wide-spread as people assumed, so you should really tone down the rhetoric until we've got an actual reason to be spitting venom at Hasbro and trying to get people to boycott one of their products....

As for your statements about third parties - why do we always need to re-hash this same nonsense? YEa, it's great if MakeToy's Metroplex is "infinitely better" (subjective) than the official version. It's also about three to four times more expensive, so that's a bit like telling people to go buy a Ferrari instead of a Honda because one person had a problem with their steering wheel falling off.... Seems like you've got some of your own past experiences clouding your ability to remain composed here.

You could probably have been a bit more condescending and patronizing if you'd tried. Probably.

Black Hat wrote:You could probably have been a bit more condescending and patronizing if you'd tried. Probably.

ROFL. Sorry if pointing out the amazingly overblown reaction you just displayed hurt your feelings, but after the post you just wrote I'm not sure how mine is the issue.

The bottom line remains - we've gotten multiple pictorial and video reviews of this figure so far, and not a one of them has mentioned this problem. It makes no sense to act like one single person having a problem negates all those who haven't had the problem.

That's not to discount Qwan's experience, and it's pretty lame that happened to him, but to assume it's going to happen to anyone else - let alone everyone else - just doesn't make any sense yet. Maybe if we start getting more confirmation of this issue from other people it's fair to start treating it like some Gold Plastic Syndrome part 2, but until then you're just putting your cart way ahead of your horse. Making people aware that this happened and that it MIGHT happen to them is fine - but why go beyond that until we have a damn good reason to pull out the pitchforks?

Has/Tak makes TONS of these toys. They're bound to have some issues here and there. No mass-produced product is immune to that reality. So far we've got more examples of this not being a problem than we have of it being a problem, and there's any number of factors that could have caused Qwans specific experience to occur - not all of which are even Hasbro's fault....

joevill wrote:I hope this issue is fixed before it hits the states.

Ditto for europe.

its gonna cost the guts of 200 euro here FFS.

The very least you should expect is a toy fit for purpose !

CarelliCollectables wrote:

Black Hat wrote:You could probably have been a bit more condescending and patronizing if you'd tried. Probably.

ROFL. Sorry if pointing out the amazingly overblown reaction you just displayed hurt your feelings, but after the post you just wrote I'm not sure how mine is the issue.

The bottom line remains - we've gotten multiple pictorial and video reviews of this figure so far, and not a one of them has mentioned this problem.

Erm....not one?

you need to have a look again pal!

william-james88 wrote:Titans Return Trypticon is the biggest toy release of the year and while we already have a gorgeous pictorial review, we have a video review for those who prefer videos. Plus it offers new things like highlighting breakage points and how to avoid them.
Hopefully this helps!