TakaraTomy Generations TG30 Waspinator & TG31 Rhinox Preorders Now Available

They both look AWESOME. I wish Rhinox was a Transmetal though. Waspinator FINALLY gets a mold he deserves! . . . and Rhinox's guns . . . are wicked!

empyre327 wrote:I wish Rhinox was a Transmetal though.

Why? He was never Transmetal in the show.

I hope to see what the TakaraTomy versions look like (these are just placeholder images of the Hasbro versions) as I want to see how Takara's Rhinox and Waspy compare to Hasbro's before I decide on which ones I want to get. For these two, I want the most show-accurately colored versions, and if Takara can get theirs colored more accurate than Hasbro's, then that's what I'll go for. But if not, Hasbro it is.

These are both must-buys for me, but I'll get the Hasbro versions. As soon as they're available for pre-order on BBTS, I'll be preordering.

Preordered from BBTS !

You are right, I think the Takara version will be more show accurate, as of lately most of the TF figures I'm buying are Takara now, I stopped getting hasbro figures,, I just like the Takara paint job better, the only thing that sucks is that I can't read the bios lol, It all started with FOC Ultra Magnus, I liked his Takara colors better than Hasbro and after I got him I decided to get all FOC Takara figures instead, now it is more expensive but I like them better. fyi Some of the FOC takara figures are on clearance now at bbts, I will be getting both Rhinox and Waspinator but I will not be placing a pre-order yet because I have so many TF pre-ordered already,,,,

You are right, I think the Takara version will be more show accurate, as of lately most of the TF figures I'm buying are Takara now, I stopped getting hasbro figures,, I just like the Takara paint job better, the only thing that sucks is that I can't read the bios lol, It all started with FOC Ultra Magnus, I liked his Takara colors better than Hasbro and after I got him I decided to get all FOC Takara figures instead, now it is more expensive but I like them better. fyi Some of the FOC takara figures are on clearance now at bbts, I will be getting both Rhinox and Waspinator but I will not be placing a pre-order yet because I have so many TF pre-ordered already,,,,

I think I'll be fine with Hasbro's offerings.

Waspinator looks a LOT like the original BW release. Split head on his chest, legs on the arm... did they actually re-make the mold or just slightly re-tool it?

Metrosuplex wrote:Waspinator looks a LOT like the original BW release. Split head on his chest, legs on the arm... did they actually re-make the mold or just slightly re-tool it?

It's an all new mold based on this:



The original toy barely looked like that.

Sabrblade wrote:

Metrosuplex wrote:Waspinator looks a LOT like the original BW release. Split head on his chest, legs on the arm... did they actually re-make the mold or just slightly re-tool it?

It's an all new mold based on this:



The original toy barely looked like that.

Still looks like a re-tool to me, Sabr.

The transformation looks the same, and though the new version may be a clearner mold, ehhhh... just saying, they kept the wheel round rather than re-mold it!

Metrosuplex wrote:Still looks like a re-tool to me, Sabr.

If no parts are the same, then it's an all new mold.

Metrosuplex wrote:The transformation looks the same,

Have the same transformation scheme =/= being the same mold. G2 Smokescreen and Energon Starscream have the same transformation, yet neither of them are the same mold.



It's just like all those many Movie Bumblebee toys that look and transform similarly but are different molds.

Metrosuplex wrote:
Still looks like a re-tool to me, Sabr.

"Re-tool", you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

A re-tool is when they take an existing mold and make some modifications to produce a new figure. A recent example would be Generations Springer/Sandstorm.

This Waspinator does, indeed, resemble the old one, but it is NOT a re-tool of that mold.

Thank you for the comparison shots... but this is all semantics. I understand I'm misusing the term horribly, but when I take a figure and slightly remold all the parts and it's still the same overall figure... it just feels like the same mold, re-tooled.

Anyway, I wouldn't point it out if not for how they're the same character/figure. It's one thing to have a Waspinator-like sub-character with similar transformation scheme... but to take the old Waspy, change up the individual parts but overall leave the figure the same? Ehhhh, tomatoes tomatoes. <-- which would make more sense if you could hear me say it!

GuyIncognito wrote:

Metrosuplex wrote:
Still looks like a re-tool to me, Sabr.

"Re-tool", you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

A re-tool is when they take an existing mold and make some modifications to produce a new figure. A recent example would be Generations Springer/Sandstorm.

This Waspinator does, indeed, resemble the old one, but it is NOT a re-tool of that mold.

I've been known to liberally misuse terms for my own purposes! Actually, it's more an issue of ignorance, but I'll admit I'm more casual than most of you, so it's also an issue of pure apathy for proper terminology.

Figure looks slick either way, but I am overall ALARMED by how similar they are, considering the engineering tech is supposed to be better today. I guess the rule of thumb is to keep things the same if poseability was great for the original toy?

Metrosuplex wrote:Thank you for the comparison shots... but this is all semantics. I understand I'm misusing the term horribly, but when I take a figure and slightly remold all the parts and it's still the same overall figure... it just feels like the same mold, re-tooled.

Anyway, I wouldn't point it out if not for how they're the same character/figure. It's one thing to have a Waspinator-like sub-character with similar transformation scheme... but to take the old Waspy, change up the individual parts but overall leave the figure the same? Ehhhh, tomatoes tomatoes. <-- which would make more sense if you could hear me say it!

They DIDN'T take the old toy and change some parts to make them new.

This new Waspinator is a completely new production, having nothing to do with the 1996 toy.

I thought Metrosuplex was just confused about what "re-tool" means, but now I'm wondering if he knows what a "mold" is, or if he's just trolling us at this point.

And already people are throwing away their money on overpriced figures when they don't even know what they look like. They could be nice. They could be crap.

I'll be getting the Hasbro versions.

GuyIncognito wrote:I thought Metrosuplex was just confused about what "re-tool" means, but now I'm wondering if he knows what a "mold" is, or if he's just trolling us at this point.

Now, now, now... let's not get mean about this. Trolling is trying to antagonize someone for the express purpose of antagonizing them, with no understanding/belief in what you're actually saying. If I were the sensitive type, I could accuse YOU GUYS of trolling me with your nerdy corrections. However, I know you're just being anal/correct about proper terminology.

So if we can just move on and stop focusing on the specific words (i.e. semantics), maybe you guys should respond to my ACTUAL point.

That is, the 96' BW Waspy looks VERY SIMILAR to this "new" one, and I'm surprised the "mold"/"figure"/"toy"/"mentally-put-in-the-word-that-makes-this-easier-to-understand" does not look all that "updated". It wasn't even a negative remark; it was a neutral observation.

But, to be honestly negative, I will add that this new TOY will no doubt include less plastic, be hollowed out, and generally feel more delicate than the 96' Waspy - just a prediction I am in no way delighted to see come true.

Oh god how horrible the toy actually looks like the character it's supposed to represent, holy crap how dare they! How DARE they make a show accurate toy, how DARE THEY!?

That's it guys, this is the last straw we should all rally together, start an angry mob and go murder the crap out of anyone we find working at Hasbro.

Lord Onixprime wrote:

empyre327 wrote:I wish Rhinox was a Transmetal though.

Why? He was never Transmetal in the show.

He wasn't in the show - but he was released as a Transmetal toy. I just don't like the non-transmetal BW toys at all.

Manterax Prime wrote:And already people are throwing away their money on overpriced figures when they don't even know what they look like. They could be nice. They could be crap.

I'll be getting the Hasbro versions.

Preorders on BBTS don't cost anything. Final pics will be out before they ship so any of us who have already preordered it will have ample time to back out if we see fit.

I've never backed out on such a preorder that I can recall, just because my assumption about the paint scheme/plastic colors being more to my liking have not failed me yet, but certainly if the final product ends up looking like crap next to the Hasbro version, you better believe I'll cancel that Takara preorder and get the Hasbro release instead. It's just that this hasn't happened to me so far with any figure that I can recall.

As for all the talk about the molds being similar, the reason is simple:

The show model in the CGI series was based on the toy but with some artistic license taken
The new toy is based somewhat on the CGI series (and obviously the comic, although I'd argue that the comic is primarily based on the CGI series, especially given the head, chest and other details) but uses modern design and engineering starting from the POV that it should look close to the CGI

It's a chicken egg thing, but this one has a solution. Since the toy came first, everything that followed was based on it. Since many of us fans liked the way the character(s) looked in the show better, we got things like Telemocha and 10th anniversary which had more show accurate paint schemes but little to no retooling to make them look more show accurate. This toy fixes that by being a completely new molded figure designed from the beginning to emulate the CGI show/comics.

xyl360 wrote: but uses modern design and engineering starting from the POV that it should look close to the CGI

By "modern", do you mean hollowed out plastic, less metal parts, and smaller size?

xyl360 wrote:This toy fixes that by being a completely new molded figure designed from the beginning to emulate the CGI show/comics.

So it IS a new "mold"? I thought someone corrected me about that... Anyway, it's remarkably similar to the original, IMO. Except that... well, it will probably be smaller and use less plastic. Looks aces, to be sure, but I hope he isn't TOO small...

Dead Metal wrote:Oh god how horrible the toy actually looks like the character it's supposed to represent, holy crap how dare they! How DARE they make a show accurate toy, how DARE THEY!?

That's it guys, this is the last straw we should all rally together, start an angry mob and go murder the crap out of anyone we find working at Hasbro.

I'll reserve judgment for the final product. These are pictures. Smoke and mirrors!

Maybe a few visual examples might help clear up the matter.

Here is Prime First Edition Bumblebee on the left, and Prime Robots in Disguise Bumblebee in the right:



Though they are both similar in appearances, they are separate molds.

Conversely, here is Prime Robots in Disguise Bumblebee on the left, and Prime Arms Micron Bumblebee on the right:



These two are the same mold, but the Arms Micron version has been given new bumpy ports on its roof for the Arms Microns to attach to, and is therefore a "remold"/"retool".

For a more extensive example, here is Prime Robots in Disguise Bumblebee on the left, and Prime Beast Hunters Bumblebee on the right:



Both the same mold, but the Beast Hunters one has been given an overhaul of new parts, being a much more extensive "remold"/"retool".


In Generations Waspinator's case, he falls into the same case as the first example.

Sabrblade wrote:Maybe a few visual examples might help clear up the matter.

Sabr, I sincerely appreciate the visual examples (and they speak volumes of your credibility), but you're fixating on the wrong point. My intention was never to argue about the definition of "mold" or "re-tool".

I'm simply stating the obvious: new Waspy is based strongly on old Waspy, and that's surprising, considering how far TF engineering has come in the last 17 YEARS. You can disagree with THIS statement, but so far, no one has actually made comment on the meat of my actual point. The word "re-tool" and "mold" is more interesting, for some reason.

Besides, BH BB is arguably a "new mold" as most of the parts are significantly changed, just as the new Waspy has a similar arrangement of parts, but slightly different shapes than old Waspy. Or maybe you're claiming it's about size: different size = new mold; same size and similar parts = re-tool. From a broad perspective, looking at the actual transformations (and assuming the new Waspy IS the same transformation), I would stretch the word "re-tool" and put it on new Waspy, in order to indicate that the old Waspy was slightly altered to create a new one (while basic engineering has remained the same).

But forget I said anything. It's astounding how much some of you guys care to argue the minutia details of what a term means in the universally exact sense, as though "mold" and "re-tool" are pre-human words that have exact definitions which are never open to interpretation. As I said before, I really don't care all that much, and I don't need opinionated corrections, as the visual "proof" itself IS open to some interpretation. Sort of like how some people will sell an opened product with all the included items/box and call it "new". I don't call that "new", but maybe you do. I'd love to argue about the word "new", but in reality, I'm far more likely to just shop with someone who agrees with my interpretation of "new." Meaning, "let's agree to disagree!"

And for the love of God, you will NOT find me ever using the word "re-tool" or "mold" again, as the inspired-ire/corrections is feeling rather unfriendly.

Metrosuplex wrote:I'm simply stating the obvious: new Waspy is based strongly on old Waspy, and that's surprising, considering how far TF engineering has come in the last 17 YEARS. You can disagree with THIS statement, but so far, no one has actually made comment on the meat of my actual point. The word "re-tool" and "mold" is more interesting, for some reason.

I did comment on it, you simply ignored it. It is inspired by the show, which was inspired by the original toy, which is what accounts for the similarities. If it was too far off from the original version, it wouldn't look anything like he does on the show and therefore would not be an accurate representation of the character, which is what Beast Wars fans like me wanted. The same goes for Rhinox.

Metrosuplex wrote:I'm simply stating the obvious: new Waspy is based strongly on old Waspy, and that's surprising, considering how far TF engineering has come in the last 17 YEARS.

Ah, now I see.

But, why is this case surprising when things like the Masterpieces do the exact same thing (but in a larger size)?

Metrosuplex wrote:Besides, BH BB is arguably a "new mold" as most of the parts are significantly changed, just as the new Waspy has a similar arrangement of parts, but slightly different shapes than old Waspy.

Hasbro has admitted to taking the Prime RID Bumblebee and changing most (but not all) of its parts to create the Prime BH Bumblebee, whereas they took no parts from the 1996 Waspinator toy to make this new one.

They made this new one from scratch, using the old Beast Wars CG cartoon model as a reference (the 1996 toy did not use the CG model as a reference because that toy was made first, with the CG model being based on the toy, but modified).

Metrosuplex wrote:Or maybe you're claiming it's about size: different size = new mold; same size and similar parts = re-tool.

Nah, size ain't an issue here.

Metrosuplex wrote:From a broad perspective, looking at the actual transformations (and assuming the new Waspy IS the same transformation), I would stretch the word "re-tool" and put it on new Waspy, in order to indicate that the old Waspy was slightly altered to create a new one (while basic engineering has remained the same).

I'd imagine it would only have a similar (but not exactly the same) transformation.

Metrosuplex wrote:But forget I said anything. It's astounding how much some of you guys care to argue the minutia details of what a term means in the universally exact sense, as though "mold" and "re-tool" are pre-human words that have exact definitions which are never open to interpretation.

We're nerds. And proud of it.

You guys got so far off topic.

The real question is, where will Takara be putting the the metallic paint?

Convoy wrote:You guys got so far off topic.

The real question is, where will Takara be putting the the metallic paint?

I hope everywhere save for the beast parts.

Convoy wrote:You guys got so far off topic.

You're right, they did. This thread got out of hand. In the future, and this goes for everyone, please don't single people out for a lack/inability of communication or a lack/inability of understanding or a difference of opinion, whatever the case may be. I don't like seeing what happened in this thread. I have never liked mob mentality and ganging up on people, whether it was only 2 people or not, and there was no reason for it to happen here.

If people want to know more information, they'll ask for it or they'll look for it. That's what the Wikis are for. This is not a classroom, you aren't teachers, there is no lesson to be taught. Except this: Knock it off.

Convoy wrote:The real question is, where will Takara be putting the the metallic paint?

Heh. That seems to be their M.O. doesn't it? I'd imagine the gold parts on Rhinox should really stand out.

Convoy wrote:You guys got so far off topic.

The real question is, where will Takara be putting the the metallic paint?

Waspinator did have a green metallic sheen to him in both bot and bug modes. I could see them using it there.

I'm just hoping they paint the yellow circles on his shoulders (like I had to for my Telemocha version ) to be accurate to the show.

It would also be nice if his missile were black rather than clear, but that likely won't happen (but I gots me some paint ).