Takara Tomy Transformers Masterpiece MP-23 Exhaust: Cancellation Rumours Addressed

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:Why do I get the feeling I was indirectly quoted...

You were

Also credited. Your help was invaluable, thanks Jelzy

All of this back and forth is exhausting. Makes me want to have a cigarette.

Seibertron wrote:All of this back and forth is exhausting. Makes me want to have a cigarette.

I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother fucker.

What? Slow news day?

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Who cares? As long as he gets released in Japan, I will find a way to get that beautiful blue winged bastard.

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Actually, I just thought of something: with no export possibilities to the U.S. or other countries outside of Japan, how would it affect the production numbers? I'd expect them to be lower, with the orders from abroad canceled, but if the figures have already produced, what would happen to them? Better keep an eye on the European stores.

Hah, the Belgium-based Archonia.com still has its Masterpiece Exhaust listing up. That's a good sign...

Just because US retailers are scared of the big bad wolf (AKA Phill Morris) that doesnt mean takara is making a smaller run of these guys. Small chinese based retailers like chimungmung and e bay sellers will buy them all up and make a killing. Then comes the inevitable KO. Phill Morris is beating a dead horse with their juvenile legal outburst. Hope canibus is legal in 5 years and phill morris goes out of business due to backyard growers and hookah bars. Screw phill morris and the god damn marlboro man !

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Actually, I just thought of something: with no export possibilities to the U.S. or other countries outside of Japan, how would it affect the production numbers? I'd expect them to be lower, with the orders from abroad canceled, but if the figures have already produced, what would happen to them? Better keep an eye on the European stores.

Well that's the exact reason I think it's going to shelf warm, I think they produced quite a few knowing it would have broader market appeal her in the US as a novelty. I don't think the Japanese market will have as much appreciation for the Diaclone homage as the U.S would. Also don't Japanese marlboro packages commonly have blue/sea-foam green as their accent color and not red?

SW's SilverHammer wrote:

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Actually, I just thought of something: with no export possibilities to the U.S. or other countries outside of Japan, how would it affect the production numbers? I'd expect them to be lower, with the orders from abroad canceled, but if the figures have already produced, what would happen to them? Better keep an eye on the European stores.

Well that's the exact reason I think it's going to shelf warm, I think they produced quite a few knowing it would have broader market appeal her in the US as a novelty. I don't think the Japanese market will have as much appreciation for the Diaclone homage as the U.S would. Also don't Japanese marlboro packages commonly have blue/sea-foam green as their accent color and not red?

A quick Google search shows that's not the case: in Japan the main color is still red. However, the flavored types (think menthol) do have different colors instead of the red.

Desslok2201 wrote:

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Who cares? As long as he gets released in Japan, I will find a way to get that beautiful blue winged ****.

Hate to be you when you buy it on ebay half price original fortress maximuss

dragons wrote:

Desslok2201 wrote:

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Who cares? As long as he gets released in Japan, I will find a way to get that beautiful blue winged ****.

Hate to be you when you buy it on ebay half price original fortress maximuss

Not really sure what one has to do with the other, but I already have one, thanks.

Desslok2201 wrote:

dragons wrote:

Desslok2201 wrote:

SW's SilverHammer wrote:I have a feeling without the more American online retailers; Exhaust is going to shelfwarm in Japan like a mother ****.

Who cares? As long as he gets released in Japan, I will find a way to get that beautiful blue winged ****.

Hate to be you when you buy it on ebay half price original fortress maximuss

Not really sure what one has to do with the other, but I already have one, thanks.

I only paid 60 bucks for my Exhaust...

The only thing I like on this toy is the head sculpt. Think wheeljack's colors look best on this toy.

I keep wanting to buy this fig but i'm hesitant because of the perceived exclusivity of it due to copyright laws and whatnot.

He's cool and all but i don't want to get caught up in the hype and rush out to get it. Also there isn't a whole lot of Decepticon MP's which also makes it very tempting.

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

fenrir72 wrote:That being the case, collectors will be importing them by bypassing Hasbro then. Somoene must really be hedging on getting this fig to make a killing in the secondary market.

They'd have to find a middle man in Japan, which there are fortunately. You just need to find them

Thinking some clever Ebay sellers from Japan. Might be able to use clever code words to sell this toy. Like sorry, this is not the right pic or description. You will not be getting Wheeljack. You'll be getting his evil twin brother. That has a different head and red colors.

When Hasbro asked ebay to forbid sellers from sellers KO's on ebay. Sellers starting using the word reissue. Most buyers knew that HasTak never reissued the G1 dinobots toys. Buyers knew these were KO toys.

methinks this battle was over as soon as Phillip Morris became aware of the mold. it didn't matter how much Takara Tommy change the paint scheme the basis of the character was still the same; a Marlboro race car.

If anyone knows anyplace that still seems to be selling them from japan, please message me.

I early pages of this thread I made mention that some Japanese toy/hobby themed companies have sold a somewhat modified Lancia with Malboro decals as an adult collectible. How they got around this stupid issue is beyond me. This is just a big issue because TF is such a hot commodity.

In makes be burst into tears that the very simple means to purchase or sell this item to make sure it isn't purchased by minors is to accept payments via Credit Cards. You can verify the age easily. Below 21 years, don't sell.

Simplicity itself.

Tsutsukakushi wrote:

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

fenrir72 wrote:That being the case, collectors will be importing them by bypassing Hasbro then. Somoene must really be hedging on getting this fig to make a killing in the secondary market.

They'd have to find a middle man in Japan, which there are fortunately. You just need to find them

Thinking some clever Ebay sellers from Japan. Might be able to use clever code words to sell this toy. Like sorry, this is not the right pic or description. You will not be getting Wheeljack. You'll be getting his evil twin brother. That has a different head and red colors.

When Hasbro asked ebay to forbid sellers from sellers KO's on ebay. Sellers starting using the word reissue. Most buyers knew that HasTak never reissued the G1 dinobots toys. Buyers knew these were KO toys.

This too.

It is disappointing to see how at this point there are still people who think Philip Morris USA is the main force behind this toy's inability to be sold to U.S. consumers, when it is actually a much greater force at work here: The United States government.

No joke, no crazy conspiracy theories; this toy cannot be sold to U.S. consumers not because of some IP infringement or something, but because doing so would be a U.S. Federal law violation.

Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any merchandise to U.S. consumers if said merchandise is perceived to be children's merchandise that even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods.

While we fans know good and well that advertising tobacco-based goods to children is not the intention behind this figure's existence at all, no matter how much we may try to separate our hobby from being mere children's playthings and instead being "collectibles" for adults, the courts WILL consider this thing a "toy" and WILL consider its Marlboro-homaging deco as advertisement of tobacco-based goods on that which they consider to be children's merchandise.

As small-minded and ignorant as that sounds, the world we live in is still not yet ready to accept the reality of adults who buy and collect toys, as the concept is still fairly new and infantile in the grand scheme of things.

If this toy were to be sold to U.S. consumers, it is Philip Morris USA who would face federal charges for allowing their brand of tobacco goods to be advertised on children's merchandise, regardless of whether it would be their direct fault for making the toy or not. They would still be at fault for letting it happen, and the courts would most assuredly see that they suffer the consequences of TakaraTomy's actions.

If we put things into perspective, it really isn't Philip Morris USA's fault that TakaraTomy decided to make this toy, but it's their hide on the line here, not Takara.

Had Takara decided to not be so faithful to the real life car's deco in the first place, instead going the route of Hyperspeed Wheeljack by using a deco that gives off only the vaguest hint of the Marlboro chevron, then it is far less likely that Philip Morris USA would have made such a fuss over this toy in the first place since a deco like Hyperspeed Wheeljack's wouldn't be deemed by the U.S. federal courts as something that might be trying to advertise tobacco-based goods on a children's toy.

Even the changes that Takara made to the deco after the fact might have possibly let this toy come to America had they gone with that changed deco from the start. But since they didn't, and had instead begun with the Marlboro-accurate deco, the deco changes came too little too late for them to fix this toy's situation. As soon as word hit everyone's radar that this toy was meant to resemble the Marlboro-sponsored racecar, this toy was forever doomed to its current fate.

The only possible way this toy could be sold to U.S. consumers at this late in the game would be for its deco to be given an extreme, radical, drastic alteration to its deco to make it almost completely dissimilar to the look of the real life Marlboro racecar. Like, by getting rid of the entire amount of its red paint altogether, or something. But that simply isn't economically financially feasible for Takara to do at this point, what with the toy virtually ready and set to go on the Japanese market.

And now they've created a halfway legal, halfway illegal black market, for a toy of all things. Amazing, if only the drafters of this could've seen this in 1998.

Remarkable.
Why can't it just be rated, "M" for mature? Just restrict the sale to children, like, I don't know, like cigarettes!?

When the hell did kids get in charge anyway? I know they're our future and everything but we're living in the present. (and the past for some.(hence the deco!))

Technically, MP Megatron was/is illegal in the US, yet I was able to get one without orange paint, glued florescent plug, or any plug for that matter.

In summary, I wasn't even that interested before the lame controversy. Just release the figure in the first deco.

Convoy wrote:Remarkable.
Why can't it just be rated, "M" for mature? Just restrict the sale to children, like, I don't know, like cigarettes!?

Sadly, to the majority of the world, a toy is a toy no matter what kind of label is slapped on its box, or what kind of market it is sold to.

Sabrblade wrote:It is disappointing to see how at this point there are still people who think Philip Morris USA is the main force behind this toy's inability to be sold to U.S. consumers, when it is actually a much greater force at work here: The United States government.

No joke, no crazy conspiracy theories; this toy cannot be sold to U.S. consumers not because of some IP infringement or something, but because doing so would be a U.S. Federal law violation.

Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.

While we fans know good and well that that's not the intention behind this figure's existence at all, no matter how much we may try to separate our hobby from being mere children's playthings and instead being "collectibles" for adults, the courts WILL consider this thing a "toy" and WILL consider its Marlboro-homaging deco as advertisement of tobacco-based goods on that which they consider to be a children's product.

As small-minded and ignorant as that sounds, the world we live in is still not yet ready to accept the reality of adults who buy and collect toys, as the concept is still fairly new and infantile in the grand scheme of things.

If this toy were to be sold to U.S. consumers, it is Philip Morris USA who would face federal charges for allowing their brand of tobacco goods to be advertised on a children's product, regardless of whether it would be their direct fault for making the toy or not. They would still be at fault for letting it happen, and the courts would most assuredly see that they suffer the consequences of TakaraTomy's actions.

If we put things into perspective, it really isn't Philip Morris USA's fault that TakaraTomy decided to make this toy, but it's their hide on the line here, not Takara.

Had Takara decided to not be so faithful to the real life car's deco in the first place, instead going the route of Hyperspeed Wheeljack by using a deco that gives off only the vaguest hint of the Marlboro chevron, then it is far less likely that Philip Morris USA would have made such a fuss over this toy in the first place since a deco like Hyperspeed Wheeljack's wouldn't be deemed by the U.S. federal courts as something that might be trying to advertise tobacco-based goods on a children's toy.

Even the changes that Takara made to the deco after the fact might have possibly let this toy come to America had they gone with that changed deco from the start. But since they didn't, and had instead begun with the Marlboro-accurate deco, the deco changes came too little too late for them to fix this toy's situation. As soon as word hit everyone's radar that this toy was meant to resemble the Marlboro-sponsored racecar, this toy was forever doomed to its current fate.

The only possible way this toy could be sold to U.S. consumers at this late in the game would be for its deco to be given an extreme, radical, drastic alteration to its deco to make it almost completely dissimilar to the look of the real life Marlboro racecar. Like, by getting rid of the entire amount of its red paint altogether, or something. But that simply isn't economically financially feasible for Takara to do at this point, what with the toy virtually ready and set to go on the Japanese market.

That's all well and good Sabrblade, and it was the impetus for this whole thing, but PM went well beyond due diligence, almost excessively. Look at the aftermath. We don't have a ban on selling to the US. We have what seems to be a complete stop on shipments ANYWHERE outside japan. We have effectively gone from an embargo on imports to the US to an almost global ban. There is no part of a scorched earth aftermath that doesn't indicate PM's efforts were in drastic excess of their legal obligations.

durroth wrote:That's all well and good Sabrblade, and it was the impetus for this whole thing, but PM went well beyond due diligence, almost excessively. Look at the aftermath. We don't have a ban on selling to the US. We have what seems to be a complete stop on shipments ANYWHERE outside japan. We have effectively gone from an embargo on imports to the US to an almost global ban. There is no part of a scorched earth aftermath that doesn't indicate PM's efforts were in drastic excess of their legal obligations.

The global embargo was more Hasbro's doing than PM since those non-U.S. Hasbro markets that tend to import Takara figures are imported by those foreign branches of Hasbro itself, like Hasbro Asia and Hasbro Australia. Hasbro's foreign branches' not carrying this figure is similar to BBTS's and other retailers' not carrying the figure. And while all of them can't sell it because of PM, PM can't let them sell it because of the federal laws prohibiting it.

If the non-U.S. markets were all handled by a different company than the American-based Hasbro, Inc., then it's possible that the figure could have been easier to get in those non-U.S. markets since a non-U.S. company not bound by U.S. laws wouldn't necessarily have to go along with the wishes of a U.S. tobacco company that doesn't want to get penalized (or even terminated) by the U.S. government. But as it is, both Hasbro and PM have to comply to the laws of their home nation. And even though Hasbro is a global company, since it is primarily an American company, its American regulation/operation influence spreads to the rest of its branches around the world.

Sabrblade posted

Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product [b]even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.


If that is the verbatim ruling, the more my thesis on selling would be most applicable.

Don't sell to children, even remotely. Check.

Again, I mentioned an overseas company selling a non transforming model of Lancia Malboro (well slightly modified patterns to be exact). (Same as Exhaust with modified decal/stamp graph)

Don't sell to children........process the transaction via Credit Card. The root of this all is selling to children is it not?

If the transaction is NOT at all sanctioned by Hasbro, well fine. They want to play safe, understandable but the way this is being handled borders to hysterically stupid.

I wonder if this will effect people trying to sell these on eBay from Japan to US buyers, and US based sellers who imported them from Japan.

Here's the email from RK. Of course I decided to keep my order!!! Hopefully I can pick up the coin off ebay if they somehow "disappear" from whatever warehouse is storing them now

Hmm...Sabrblade posits the laws regarding Tobacco product marketing is the real reason behind PM's argent pursuit of this matter, but it can't be ALL the reason - if it were the term "trademark infringement" would not have been used.

PM wasn't making a dime off of licensing of their "brand" via this toy. The quotes are there because Exhaust never specifically uses the Marlboro name, but heavily references the design.

There is an easy and simple fix for this, put an easy to remove sticker or vinyl cling on the figure over the red parts. If it's sold not looking like a PM 'infringing' product and the end user/buyer modifies it problem solved.

fenrir72 wrote:Sabrblade posted

Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product [b]even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.


If that is the verbatim ruling, the more my thesis on selling would be most applicable.

Don't sell to children, even remotely. Check.

Again, I mentioned an overseas company selling a non transforming model of Lancia Malboro (well slightly modified patterns to be exact). (Same as Exhaust with modified decal/stamp graph)

Don't sell to children........process the transaction via Credit Card. The root of this all is selling to children is it not?

If the transaction is NOT at all sanctioned by Hasbro, well fine. They want to play safe, understandable but the way this is being handled borders to hysterically stupid.

No, it isn't verbatim, but a paraphrasing on my part. But as far as the courts are concerned, any merchandise they deem to be a "toy" would be considered merchandise meant to be sold to children, regardless of who its intended demographic really is. Even if it's being sold to adults, they will come down on PM for letting it be sold, period, because it is perceived as merchandise meant for children.

Perhaps a better wording on my part would have been, it is illegal for any company to sell any merchandise to U.S. consumers if said merchandise is perceived to be children's merchandise that even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods.

Doesn't Repro Label save everything? Make a white figure and have Repro Labels make stickers.

Sabrblade wrote:Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.

Comic books aren't considered children's merhandise anymore.

Nor are PG-13 movies.

And that thing on Human Alliance Jazz's packaging isn't advertising anything.

sol magnus wrote:Hmm...Sabrblade posits the laws regarding Tobacco product marketing is the real reason behind PM's argent pursuit of this matter, but it can't be ALL the reason - if it were the term "trademark infringement" would not have been used.

PM wasn't making a dime off of licensing of their "brand" via this toy. The quotes are there because Exhaust never specifically uses the Marlboro name, but heavily references the design.

One reason is used to cover up the other. The change in design may have made the trademark infringement itself practically moot, but the other claim still stands.

To make a long story short, the major problem is the US legislation regarding merchandise referencing tobacco products. All Phillip Morris is doing is acting upon it by trying to eliminate any possible lead to the company via Exhaust (first citing "trademark infringement" to get TakaraTomy to radically change the design and remove the connection). Given he's directly based on the Diaclone figure that bares the Marlboro marks, which is part of its appeal to the hardcore fans, that'll be hard to do.

This topic is so funny to me because right now on eBay, anyone can actually already buy this. However, they are obviously KO's, but they are KO's of an unreleased toy. If the real version does not get released, it's no worry, due to the overwhelming availability of this toy already, albiet in an unfortunate and unscrupulous form.

For the sake of pedantic semantic clarity, I've gone back and edited several of my posts to change the words "products" and "items" to "merchandise", in order to better understand what kinds of products these laws refer to. Films and comic books aren't in the same category as the courts wouldn't outright consider either of them (especially a movie like AOE) to be primarily meant for children, like they would for toys.

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:

sol magnus wrote:Hmm...Sabrblade posits the laws regarding Tobacco product marketing is the real reason behind PM's argent pursuit of this matter, but it can't be ALL the reason - if it were the term "trademark infringement" would not have been used.

PM wasn't making a dime off of licensing of their "brand" via this toy. The quotes are there because Exhaust never specifically uses the Marlboro name, but heavily references the design.

One reason is used to cover up the other. The change in design may have made the trademark infringement itself practically moot, but the other claim still stands.

To make a long story short, the major problem is the US legislation regarding merchandise referencing tobacco products. All Phillip Morris is doing is acting upon it by trying to eliminate any possible lead to the company via Exhaust (first citing "trademark infringement" to get TakaraTomy to radically change the design and remove the connection). Given he's directly based on the Diaclone figure that bares the Marlboro marks, which is part of its appeal to the hardcore fans, that'll be hard to do.

Oh, I'm well aware they are using one legal bit to enforce another, but my point is that isn't just about "marketing cigarettes to kids". For one thing, it is only enforceable against companies in the US. Yet, Phillip Morris is also pursuing this worldwide. Additionally, if the Master Tobacco Settlement Agreement governs certain types of marketing in THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, then okay - no Exhaust marketed and sold - in THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. No where in the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement is there any type or form of concession for sales and marketing overseas (which is evident since Takara did not outright cancel the product). Why a Kapow Toys or Robotkingdom or whomever would have to abide by an American law where they do not directly market their products is unclear to me.

If, as an American I purchase this product out of the United States and have it imported, then the only person at risk for "legal trouble" is me - as I am in possession of an item that could be construed as marketing tobbaco products to a minor. The origin country is under no such limitation...so they go the Trademark violation route. Why? to stop 200 or so of these from reaching American shores? Really? That is nothing, monetarily speaking. No - Takara did not get permission to use their trademark dress, thus they aren't getting paid in the markets where they have no ability to stop the sale of the merchandise in question.

It's the only thing that really makes any sense.

BTW- JelZe, your join date is my birthdate (when I was 31).

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.

Comic books aren't considered children's products anymore.

Nor are PG-13 movies.

And that thing on Human Alliance Jazz's packaging isn't advertising anything.

I guess that would make comic books "adult products" then. Might as well make Archie the new poster boy for the Colorado legalization movement.

You got me on the movie. But seeing as how it's the flagship of a Hasbro franchise, it makes them look like a bunch of hypocrites over this Marlboor thing. Hasbro technically does own Takara, right ?

On the sideswipe packaging, it is advertising something....its advertising smoking in general.

You quoted "it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children".

A fictional cigarette advertisement on a children's toy box is ok, but an altered red bow tie on the hood of a car is not ? Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won. Is this even the same Hasbro legal department that shut down KO toys and scared the crap out of Chimungmung ? I think not...

Rated X wrote:Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won.

I think you mean TakaraTomy, not Hasbro, since this toy is all Takara's doing.

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won.

I think you mean TakaraTomy, not Hasbro, since this toy is all Takara's doing.

Also, people are conflating cigarettes as a product category with Philip Morris the specific brand of cigarettes.

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won.

I think you mean TakaraTomy, not Hasbro, since this toy is all Takara's doing.

The only reason why Hasbro is mentioned is because two of its branches (Australia and Asia) import TakaraTomy products on a regular basis for their own territories.

Also, Hasbro itself did not get warned by Phillip Morris, it's basically any store that can potential sell merchandise to customers in the U.S., or rather where the U.S. is the main target market. I don't know how far the law stretches, but it's safe to assume that any company or store with links to the U.S. (Hasbro Asia included) is a potential target.

I should investigate how European law deals with this matter, but I can tell you this: here in the Netherlands and Belgium we used to have chocolates in the shape of cigarettes back in the day. Emphasis on "used to have" as I haven't seen any in ages.

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won.

I think you mean TakaraTomy, not Hasbro, since this toy is all Takara's doing.

Who legally owns the MP Wheeljack mold ? If there was a dispute between Hasbro and Takara/Tomy, who would wint rights to that mold (or any mold) in court ?

I was under the assumption that Hasbro runs the show and "allows" Takara/Tomy to do their thing. (Hence Hasbro Asia Divison and the molds being stored in China, not Japan) Correct me if Im wrong.

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won.

I think you mean TakaraTomy, not Hasbro, since this toy is all Takara's doing.

Who legally owns the MP Wheeljack mold ? If there was a dispute between Hasbro and Takara/Tomy, who would wint rights to that mold (or any mold) in court ?

I was under the assumption that Hasbro runs the show and "allows" Takara/Tomy to do their thing. (Hence Hasbro Asia Divison and the molds being stored in China, not Japan) Correct me if Im wrong.

It's the other way around: TakaraTomy owns the brand now and licenses it to Hasbro, hence the "Manufactured under license from TOMY Company, ltd."

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won.

I think you mean TakaraTomy, not Hasbro, since this toy is all Takara's doing.

Who legally owns the MP Wheeljack mold ? If there was a dispute between Hasbro and Takara/Tomy, who would wint rights to that mold (or any mold) in court ?

I was under the assumption that Hasbro runs the show and "allows" Takara/Tomy to do their thing. (Hence Hasbro Asia Divison and the molds being stored in China, not Japan) Correct me if Im wrong.

The Masterpiece line is all Takara's baby, as it was Takara's idea. Hasbro's fine with Takara making it, but it's all Takara whose behind that particular line.

Hasbro's only ever made one MP mold on their own, that which being the Targtmaster Offshoot figure that came with Hasbro's release of the MP Rodimus mold.

Just give me the Freaking Toy already...!

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:

Rated X wrote:

Sabrblade wrote:Under the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement and the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children.

Comic books aren't considered children's products anymore.

Nor are PG-13 movies.

And that thing on Human Alliance Jazz's packaging isn't advertising anything.

I guess that would make comic books "adult products" then. Might as well make Archie the new poster boy for the Colorado legalization movement.

You got me on the movie. But seeing as how it's the flagship of a Hasbro franchise, it makes them look like a bunch of hypocrites over this Marlboor thing. Hasbro technically does own Takara, right ?

On the sideswipe packaging, it is advertising something....its advertising smoking in general.

You quoted "it is illegal for any company to sell any product to U.S. consumers if said product even remotely gives off the slightest minuscule impression of advertising tobacco-based goods to children".

A fictional cigarette advertisement on a children's toy box is ok, but an altered red bow tie on the hood of a car is not ? Hasbro's big bad leagal department turned into a bunch of pu**ys. They should have taken Phill Morris to court, for sure they would have won. Is this even the same Hasbro legal department that shut down KO toys and scared the crap out of Chimungmung ? I think not...

That's what you get when you (the people)allow equally stupid know it alls (politicians) to try and legislate the "bad" things away. It WON'T!

Deviate a bit at legislation stupidities. Attempts to legislate the use of firearms in a country founded in the use of firearms hence you get a Megatron with orange caps. You get incidences where a toddler is suspended when he makes a gun gesture bang bang with his hands and fingers. STUPID NO?

Then we have that asinine ruling that's the root case of this controversy. Ayayayay! Ay caramba!

And that example used by "X", no matter how it not endorsing a particular brand just goes to show how stupid this issue really IS! Smoke cigars, no issue but smoke PM cigars..........ohhhhhh so bad.......

The bastard about this whole thing is they jacked up the deco and it's still the same issue and will be canceled in many markets...therefor they shoulda just left the damn thing as it was and released it to the same market as a better figure.

omega666 wrote:Doesn't Repro Label save everything? Make a white figure and have Repro Labels make stickers.

Reprolabels wont touch Marlboor Wheeljack AKA Exhaust with a ten foot pole. It is a four letter word to them.