Seibertron.com Energon Pub Forums

[Kurona]

I dont know this stuff too well, can someone explain how Cancer is just a dude in one pic and then a headmaster robot in others?

The headmaster robot is more like a tech suit summoned by those rings. It's kind of like a magical girl transformation except with less mini-skirts and more becoming body parts.

[primalxconvoy]

I dont know this stuff too well, can someone explain how Cancer is just a dude in one pic and then a headmaster robot in others?

"The Headmaster Juniors (ヘッドマスターJr. Heddomasutā Jr.) are a group of Earth humans selected by the Autobots and the Decepticons to fight by their side. They use a form of technology called Master-Braces to armor-up their bodies and allow themselves to transform into the heads of transtectors.

Source: - http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Headmaster_Junior

[Cobotron]

I dont know this stuff too well, can someone explain how Cancer is just a dude in one pic and then a headmaster robot in others?

It looks like in the first frame, he is clicking his bracelets together in some kind of power-up motion. Maybe? Perhaps that is how he adorns his suit?

EDIT: Sorry. Didn't turn the page. What Kurona and Primalx said. I'm still powering up with coffee...

Primalx - I saw in the TR thread a decent fix for Scourge's loose neck that used a little piece cut from an old credit card and pushed down in between the collar/torso and the clip the holds the TM's head. Haven't tried it myself, but it sounded like an easy and good solution.

[Sabrblade]

Here, Will, lemme show ya how the Headmaster Junior process is done.

First the Autobots:



And the Decepticons:



Though, don't let their human heads wearing helmets fool you, as unlike the Headmasters, Targetmasters, and Powermasters of the Western fiction, the Headmaster Juniors (and later the Godmasters) aren't mere humans wearing armored suits over their flesh-and-blood bodies. Rather, their human flesh-and-blood bodies physically change into fully robotic bodies via a Cybertronian "magic" power called the Masterforce (channeled through wrist-worn bracelet-like devices called Master-Braces), with only their heads remaining humanoid. And their connection to the Transtectors in Robot Mode isn't a Gundam-esque "human operator in a cockpit" connection, but rather, the Headmaster Juniors and Godmasters physically became one with the Transtectors in mind, body, and spirit. In their Robot Modes, they are, for all intents and purposes, full-fledged super robot lifeform Autobots and Decepticons given life by human souls rather than Cybertronian sparks.

Essentially, Masterforce is kind of show in which normal human beings are given the opportunity to physically become actual fully-robotic Autobots and Decepticons, and have the ability to go back to being a flesh-and-blood humans whenever they wanted. Now, that, to me, sounds like an offer I'd readily take up.

[Evil Eye]

Essentially, Masterforce is kind of show in which normal human beings are given the opportunity to physically become actual fully-robotic Autobots and Decepticons, and have the ability to go back to being a flesh-and-blood humans whenever they wanted. Now, that, to me, sounds like an offer I'd readily take up.

Holy slag I'd take up that offer in a heartbeat.

[fenrir72]

Here, Will, lemme show ya how the Headmaster Junior process is done.

First the Autobots:



And the Decepticons:



Though, don't let their human heads wearing helmets fool you, as unlike the Headmasters, Targetmasters, and Powermasters of the Western fiction, the Headmaster Juniors (and later the Godmasters) aren't mere humans wearing armored suits over their flesh-and-blood bodies. Rather, their human flesh-and-blood bodies physically change into fully robotic bodies via a Cybertronian "magic" power called the Masterforce (channeled through wrist-worn bracelet-like devices called Master-Braces), with only their heads remaining humanoid. And their connection to the Transtectors in Robot Mode isn't a Gundam-esque "human operator in a cockpit" connection, but rather, the Headmaster Juniors and Godmasters physically became one with the Transtectors in mind, body, and spirit. In their Robot Modes, they are, for all intents and purposes, full-fledged super robot lifeform Autobots and Decepticons given life by human souls rather than Cybertronian sparks.

Essentially, Masterforce is kind of show in which normal human beings are given the opportunity to physically become actual fully-robotic Autobots and Decepticons, and have the ability to go back to being a flesh-and-blood humans whenever they wanted. Now, that, to me, sounds like an offer I'd readily take up.

What is Masterforce?

The JP source reference.:

http://web.archive.org/web/200310052209 ... mfqna.html

or: Transformers: Super-God Masterforce Daikuzan


According to Jean Minakaze himself aka Starsaber's adopted son.

The Masterforce allows the HM Jrs to become the "sparks" of the TF. They are NOT cyborgs or turn into robots. They are very much human unlike the Darkwings who welcomed Devil Z turning them into fully mechanized beings in the last few episodes.

[Sabrblade]

...I have no idea what point you're trying to make, especially with the archives of an old fansite rather than using the show itself to make whatever your point is.

Also, the Victory's kid's name is "Jan". The "Jean" fan spelling was confirmed back in February to be inaccurate, with production documents from the Victory cartoon revealing "Jan" to have been the intended official spelling all along.

[karyuudo]

Good evening everyone.

We took some time out this weekend to translate one of the newer Legends comics (LG24 Shockwave & Cancer Prequel)

You can check it out here if you're interested.
http://karyuudofansubs.blogspot.com/201 ... equel.html

Enjoy!

[fenrir72]

...I have no idea what point you're trying to make, especially with the archives of an old fansite rather than using the show itself to make whatever your point is.

Also, the Victory's kid's name is "Jan". The "Jean" fan spelling was confirmed back in February to be inaccurate, with production documents from the Victory cartoon revealing "Jan" to have been the intended official spelling all along.

The main source of the defunct "fansite" is this Transformers: Super-God Masterforce Daikuzan which is opposite your interpretation of the HM/GM turning into robots. They don't. Only the Darkwings turn into full robots at the near end of the series. The Jrs like Minerva are still fully human and as stated not cyborgs which runs opposite to your interpretation that they turn into mechanical beings. and these trivia is based on those TeleVi TF mags which get their references direct from the source aka Takara/Toei.

The Magazine also presents the explanation on why there was a lifeless transtector for Ginrai which has never been debunked.

As for the Jan/Jean reference, you already answered that ."Intended" but it was never used so we stick to what was used......Jean which again was never the subject of my post.

[Sabrblade]

As for the Jan/Jean reference, you already answered that ."Intended" but it was never used so we stick to what was used......Jean which again was never the subject of my post.

What was used in the show was merely ジャン in spoken dialogue form only. There was no onscreen text that spelled his name in English in the show.

[chuckdawg1999]

Is it safe to assume that the Japanese HMJRs and GM borrowed heavily from Sentai and Kamen Rider? You guys do know they made Role Play Bracelets?

[Jelze Bunnycat]

Is it safe to assume that the Japanese HMJRs and GM borrowed heavily from Sentai and Kamen Rider? You guys do know they made Role Play Bracelets?

Just the suit and robot concept are borrowed from Tokusatsu (the proper term for such series), really. Even then, they don't fight monsters-of-the-week in Masterforce, so the comparison isn't that strong. However, another Takara series went all out on that: Yuusha Shirei Dagwon or Brave Command Dagwon, with monsters, and the heroes spirit merging with their mechs.

[fenrir72]

As for the Jan/Jean reference, you already answered that ."Intended" but it was never used so we stick to what was used......Jean which again was never the subject of my post.

What was used in the show was merely ジャン in spoken dialogue form only. There was no onscreen text that spelled his name in English in the show.

Again. My focus of the post is on the transformation to flesh and machine not the name of the "narrator" of the Televi Magazine.

[fenrir72]

Is it safe to assume that the Japanese HMJRs and GM borrowed heavily from Sentai and Kamen Rider? You guys do know they made Role Play Bracelets?

Just the suit and robot concept are borrowed from Tokusatsu (the proper term for such series), really. Even then, they don't fight monsters-of-the-week in Masterforce, so the comparison isn't that strong. However, another Takara series went all out on that: Yuusha Shirei Dagwon or Brave Command Dagwon, with monsters, and the heroes spirit merging with their mechs.

And waaaaaaaaay back, Gatchaman did the transformation thing. Still flesh and blood except for Joe in season 2. But that is another story. But yes, Masterforce really did a lot of borrowing from previous concepts as the HM who borrowed from Jeeg

[Insurgent]

I still can't figure out that comic, but I love how happy Minerva is to see Cancer at the end.

[Sabrblade]

I still can't figure out that comic,

How so?

[Decepticon Stryker]

Also, LOL, the Sweeps are sweeping.

This is probably the first time this really obvious joke has been done. unless it was in the Headmasters cartoon. But still, it's hilarious.

[Decepticon Stryker]

I like how they put the red and blue Fort Max from Armada in there.
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Peritus_Maximus

[Sabrblade]

I like how they put the red and blue Fort Max from Armada in there.
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Peritus_Maximus

Er, no, that's Grand Maximus. Fort Max's younger brother.

[Decepticon Stryker]

I like how they put the red and blue Fort Max from Armada in there.
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Peritus_Maximus

Er, no, that's Grand Maximus. Fort Max's younger brother.

My bad. I haven't seen Headmasters or wherever he's from.

[primalxconvoy]

I still can't figure out that comic,

How so?

I have to agree. I couldn't understand the translation. For me, the speech bubbles and design are in the wrong order. In Japan it sometimes reads right to left, so translated comics need to either "flip" the panel's, edit the speech bubbles, or put text in the existing bubbles in a "Western" order.

Also, the text seems to be translated literally, rather than using a final layer of cultural translation. An example (not used in the comic) is below:

Japanese: - "Shitsureshimasu"

Literal translation: - "I am coming through/into here".

Cultural Translation #1 (Polite Autobot, knocking at the door) - May I come in, please?

Cultural Translation #2 (Autobot in a hurry, transforming and speeding through a group of other Autobots) - "'Scuse me, coming through!

Context defines the use of language. Other examples include the omission of inspiration or extra clarity, depending on the language and/or cultural situation (e.g., the omission of pronouns in Japanese, or using implication or inference appropriately), changing information to be culturally relevant/appropriate (Western Transformer names/terms, changing terms or situations for moral purposes, etc).

[Sabrblade]

I still can't figure out that comic,

How so?

I have to agree. I couldn't understand the translation. For me, the speech bubbles and design are in the wrong order. In Japan it sometimes reads right to left, so translated comics need to either "flip" the panel's, edit the speech bubbles, or put text in the existing bubbles in a "Western" order.

Virtually every avid reader of manga would beg to differ with that notion. Reading panels right-to-left isn't that difficult.

Also, the text seems to be translated literally, rather than using a final layer of cultural translation. An example (not used in the comic) is below:

Japanese: - "Shitsureshimasu"

Literal translation: - "I am coming through/into here".

Cultural Translation #1 (Polite Autobot, knocking at the door) - May I come in, please?

Cultural Translation #2 (Autobot in a hurry, transforming and speeding through a group of other Autobots) - "'Scuse me, coming through!

Context defines the use of language. Other examples include the omission of inspiration or extra clarity, depending on the language and/or cultural situation (e.g., the omission of pronouns in Japanese, or using implication or inference appropriately), changing information to be culturally relevant/appropriate (Western Transformer names/terms, changing terms or situations for moral purposes, etc).

On this, I will agree. Some of the lines do read as being a little stiff to me. Perhaps Karyuudo will chime in about this.

Though, the terminology needn't be altered in this case since the particular characters in question are all Japanese-original ones who have no differing English-language counterpart names, and more recent times have led to more and more Japanese-original names and terms being used in English TF media anyway.

[primalxconvoy]

I still can't figure out that comic,

How so?

I have to agree. I couldn't understand the translation. For me, the speech bubbles and design are in the wrong order. In Japan it sometimes reads right to left, so translated comics need to either "flip" the panel's, edit the speech bubbles, or put text in the existing bubbles in a "Western" order.

Virtually every avid reader of manga would beg to differ with that notion. Reading panels right-to-left isn't that difficult.

Also, the text seems to be translated literally, rather than using a final layer of cultural translation. An example (not used in the comic) is below:

Japanese: - "Shitsureshimasu"

Literal translation: - "I am coming through/into here".

Cultural Translation #1 (Polite Autobot, knocking at the door) - May I come in, please?

Cultural Translation #2 (Autobot in a hurry, transforming and speeding through a group of other Autobots) - "'Scuse me, coming through!

Context defines the use of language. Other examples include the omission of inspiration or extra clarity, depending on the language and/or cultural situation (e.g., the omission of pronouns in Japanese, or using implication or inference appropriately), changing information to be culturally relevant/appropriate (Western Transformer names/terms, changing terms or situations for moral purposes, etc).

On this, I will agree. Some of the lines do read as being a little stiff to me. Perhaps Karyuudo will chime in about this.

Though, the terminology needn't be altered in this case since the particular characters in question are all Japanese-original ones who have no differing English-language counterpart names, and more recent times have led to more and more Japanese-original names and terms being used in English TF media anyway.

Thanks for the reply. Although I agree that manga fans might be more inclined to read Japanese comics "Japanese style", not all are, and certainly not all Transformers fans.

That doesn't mean that it's "wrong" to have the pages on their original form, but it does explain why some people, including myself, may find it difficult. I actually live in Japan, and even I found the comic a challenge, especially as not all TF manga in Japan reads right to left (I think the Grand Scourge one was left to right). Sometimes, a flip and/or a different order for the ditch bubbles (just popping the text in a different bubble order) can really help.

As for the Japanese names, then in this comic, "Cancer" would be more autopsies as it's distinct from its Western counterpart (Lokos), although with the potential issues surrounding the term "Cancer" (due to its ambiguity), there is also that, too (but that's a separate discussion).

[william-james88]

The planet in Japanese is called Seibertron?
Also I don't read manga, but reading from right to left isn't hard at all. The panels are done in a way to encourage you to read it that way.

[Sabrblade]

The planet in Japanese is called Seibertron?

In Japanese G1, Beast Era, and Unicron Trilogy-related media, yes. Pronounced like "say-ber-tron", as the Autobot faction was called "Cybertron" ("sigh-ber-tron").

Since 2007, however, Takara has taken to using more and more Hasbro terminology to create a better sense of global cohesiveness for the brand in Japan, so things like the movies, Animated, Prime, Go!, Adventure, etc. use "Cybertron" for the planet's name in the Japanese versions of those.

But since this comic is part of the Japanese G1 continuity, Sakamoto-san likely wanted to preserve the original Japanese terminology for this comic so as to better allow it to tie in with the 1980s Japanese media.

Here's a rundown of which toylines in Japan (and their respective media of fiction) used which names from 2007 to today:

Binaltech (2007 onward) - Takara names
Masterpiece (2007 onward) - Takara names
2007 Movie 1 - Hasbro names
Beast Wars Telemocha Series - Takara names
Encore - Takara names
Music Label - Takara names (save for the fully-colored Music Label Optimus Prime)
Sports Label - Takara names
Henkei! Henkei! - Takara names
Alternity - Takara names
Revenge of the Fallen - Hasbro names
Device Label - Takara names
Autobot Alliance - Hasbro names
Animated - Hasbro names (save for renaming Bulkhead as "Ironhide" and Ironhide as "Armorhide")
United - Hasbro names
Dark of the Moon - Hasbro names
Chronicle - Hasbro names and Takara names for certain figures (the two box sets used Hasbro names, while the EZ Collection figures used Hasbro names for only the Movieverse Legends class molds and Takara names for the G1/G2-based Legends class molds)
Prime Arms Micron - Hasbro names
Generations - Hasbro names
BeCool - all new names by Takara based on the toys' altmodes
Cap Bots - all new names by Takara but based on Hasbro's kind of names
GT - all new names by Takara based on Hasbro's names
Kre-O - Hasbro names
Go! - Hasbro names for the non-new characters, all new names by Takara for the new characters
Cloud - Hasbro names (save for Hot Rodimus)
Movie Advanced Series - Hasbro names
Lost Age Series - Hasbro names
Legends - BOTH names! Takara names in Katakana, Hasbro names in Latin script
Q-Transformers - A varying mixture of Hasbro and Takara names
Adventure Series - Hasbro names for the most part, but Greejeeber, Adams, and (supposedly) Stepper use Takara names in both Katakana and Latin script, while Shrapnel has his Takara name "Sharpnel" in Katakana and his Hasbro name in Latin script
Easy Dynamic Series - Hasbro names
Mini-Con Series - some Hasbro names, some all new names by Takara
Unite Warriors - Takara names in Katakana and Hasbro names in Latin script