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MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

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MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby FracturedKoi » Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:19 pm

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Good evening, friends! It's been far too long and I apologize for my absence from the forums. Facebook has just made connecting so much easier that I've neglected any presence on here, forgive me. It's okay though, because MP-36 just came out and I thought what a better way to come back to the forums than to shoot another set of comparison images.

I will admit that while I love the animation accurate look of his robot mode I honestly do not like his gun mode at all. Instead of seeking a license and reproducing a Walther P-38, they chose (possibly wisely?) to instead model his gun mode after his cartoon appearance. Now, I can understand why they'd do this. Less fees for licensing, slightly fewer headaches with firearm realism and the legal ramifications thereof, and perhaps even a little bit more creative freedom. In my mind, though, his alt-mode just suffers for it. Both his G1 iteration and the first MP version have a much more accurate gun mode.

But enough of that, on with the images. Following each image, I'll try to comment as to what I'm attempting to compare.

IMG_7226.JPG

Notice the size difference. While nowhere near as oversized as his first MP release, 36 is still far oversized.

IMG_7227.JPG

Another angle showing size differences. The plate on top of the gun (which contains the firing pin and safety mechanism) is much thicker. The only reason I can see for this is to allow for how they're attaching Megatron's scope (which is STILL a horrible idea and now it's even less feasible than it was on the G1 toy. That toy has a black bracket which is supposed to imply that it's attached to the frame and goes around the slide to prevent it from moving with the slide.) Interestingly enough, the sights on 36 are identical to those found on a Walther...but more on that later.

IMG_7229.JPG

Detail showing the grips. 36 still uses the WWII Bakelite grips and keeps many of the details spot on. Notice the safety is switched on for both guns. I've seen so many images of 36's safety flipped way out of alignment and it's bugged me to no end. Glad to know it does go where intended. The screw detail is still present on 36 as is the details for the takedown lever (out of frame) and slide lock (horizontal lever above trigger). Things really start to fall apart with the grips, though, as Takara has zero detail at the bottom for any sort of magazine functionality; they replaced it with the cartoon accurate bracket...thing. Ung. They also have no detail for the lanyard strap either.

IMG_7232.JPG

Side-by-side profile showing frame and grip details, safety now moved to fire position. Here you can clearly see the takedown lever (front of frame, close to Megatron's head). Of note, while G1 had "serial numbers" and even one of Walther's proof marks "stamped" on it, 36 has no such details anywhere. There isn't one place where a proof mark, serial number, or even the Walther banner were put on the toy. This isn't a Walther but it's mimicking one closely. Many of the gun details are so broken up by panels that it's difficult to tell what you're looking at. The takedown lever, for example, is split in half and has a pin running right through it on the toy.

IMG_7235.JPG

IMG_7234.JPG

Here's a pretty awesome detail, though: the front sights are dovetailed into position (well, not really, but kudos for the sculpting!)

IMG_7237.JPG

IMG_7236.JPG

More awesome detail work replicating the extractor. This little bar inlaid into the top of the slide grabs the casing of the spend round and flings it out and to the left of the shooter! On the toy, it too is split by seams and in two places no less! It's difficult to make a gun transform.

IMG_7238.JPG

IMG_7239.JPG

Sight picture on 36 is hindered greatly by the scope mount. However, by flipping that mounting point out 90 degrees, you're able to get a clear sight picture...which will be the first image in the next post in thread....
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby FracturedKoi » Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:30 pm

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IMG_7240.JPG

Now, with the sight mount twisted to the side, you actually get a clear sight picture. Blam! Take that Lego castle! (I just noticed that some of these images aren't straight...sorry about that.)

IMG_7242.JPG

IMG_7241.JPG

Here's another great detail, that small plate you see on the real gun rides against the frame. That's your trigger mechanism and they replicated it on the toy! Awesome?

IMG_7244.JPG

From the rear with the hammer's cocked. Aside from 36 being horribly too thick, there's also nothing for his hammer to actually strike. The firing pin is that metallic circle you see on the actual firearm. The small circle above it is the loaded-chamber indicator. If a round is chambered, a small rod protrudes through that to let you know that yes, it is indeed ready to be fired.

IMG_7245.JPG

A Walther P-38 (or a P1, which is what I have) is chambered in 9mm. The barrel will nearly fit inside the toy's barrel! A 9mm would fall through that barrel like a penny through a well. I haven't measured the inside diameter of the toy's barrel to try and figure out what caliber it is.

IMG_7247.JPG

One last detail image: they've outlined the shape of the barrel as it's inserted into the slide. As the gun functions, the slide will, well...slide around the barrel, kinda like this:
IMG_7249.JPG

Shown is the slide locked back as it would be on an empty magazine.

I hope you guys have enjoyed this brief look at 36 and how he compares to a real firearm. He really does try, but that cartoon detailing just gets in his way from nailing it 100%. Whatever the case, this figure truly is a masterpiece. Thanks for your time, guys and gals, and have a great night!
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby fenrir72 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 9:40 pm

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:APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE: :APPLAUSE:

Thank you for the efforts of comparison. So the figure is still bigger than the real stuff huh? What about the original toy? Can you also post a comparison too?

Also, if Takara really went full monty on realism, the fans and the Feds will really will go bananas in interdicting (the Feds especially)it's distribution to the general public. So that part on the handle is a necessary evil (or good)
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby FracturedKoi » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:03 pm

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Thanks for that reminder; here's a link to my first photo shoot!

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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:20 pm

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One question concerning the grips: do you think they could be region-specific? The Walther P38 had a number of regional variants I believe, can the grip be an indicator of such? Like did Japan ever get the other grip type?
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby FracturedKoi » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:26 pm

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Excellent question. P38 initially shipped with bakealite grips that had a horizontal line pattern like Megatrons did. They could vary in color from brown to black but proved to be very prone to chipping and breaking, bakealite is a fragile plastic. These were later replaced with walnut grips of the same pattern. All guns used in WWII had the same horizontal pattern. The checkered pattern seen on mine only started after the war and the grips on mine are also a sturdy plastic.

I'm no historian, so all of this is just to the best of my knowledge, someone else may know more.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:48 pm

Motto: "The only good is knowledge, and the only evil is ignorance."
On the side, do you own any other guns or firearms? Specifically the FN Model 1910, that Browning is modeled after?
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby fenrir72 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 10:53 pm

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FracturedKoi wrote:Thanks for that reminder; here's a link to my first photo shoot!

comparing-g1-megatron-to-his-real-life-counterpart-now-with-100-more-pictures--t95097.php


4 years ago?! So the original is indeed smaller that the real thing. Must be intentional 'cause if it was 1/1. really, a whole lot of legal hurdles given how almost realistic the toy is.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Sun Apr 16, 2017 11:00 pm

Motto: "The only good is knowledge, and the only evil is ignorance."
fenrir72 wrote:
FracturedKoi wrote:Thanks for that reminder; here's a link to my first photo shoot!

comparing-g1-megatron-to-his-real-life-counterpart-now-with-100-more-pictures--t95097.php


4 years ago?! So the original is indeed smaller that the real thing. Must be intentional 'cause if it was 1/1. really, a whole lot of legal hurdles given how almost realistic the toy is.


Back then the gun laws were more lax, and practically non-existent in Japan :lol: The only legal hurdle were the plastic bullets that were omitted from the US release (thank you, Battlestar Galactica). And size does not matter: RtS Legends Megatron still required an orange-colored end on the barrel.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby fenrir72 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:08 am

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JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:
fenrir72 wrote:
FracturedKoi wrote:Thanks for that reminder; here's a link to my first photo shoot!

comparing-g1-megatron-to-his-real-life-counterpart-now-with-100-more-pictures--t95097.php


4 years ago?! So the original is indeed smaller that the real thing. Must be intentional 'cause if it was 1/1. really, a whole lot of legal hurdles given how almost realistic the toy is.


Back then the gun laws were more lax, and practically non-existent in Japan :lol: The only legal hurdle were the plastic bullets that were omitted from the US release (thank you, Battlestar Galactica). And size does not matter: RtS Legends Megatron still required an orange-colored end on the barrel.


For us adults with properly wired brains it may sound ridiculous but for morons who like to point one on cops or normal citizens, yes it is indeed a big issue. Hence why I got the Takara version of RTS Megs. As for Japan having lax laws on fake guns? iirc, they are like super strict on guns. If such strictness is applied to replicas, that's another story.

Now back to if it was 1/1.......
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby FracturedKoi » Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:00 am

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JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:On the side, do you own any other guns or firearms? Specifically the FN Model 1910, that Browning is modeled after?



I do own several other firearms; two Walther p1's, a Taurus Judge, a Walther PPK/S, and an Arisaka which my grandpa brought back from WWII. Sadly, I do not own an FN 1910. I imagine that a PPK would be a similar size.

When I get back from Seattle on Saturday I'll see if I can get a couple pics.

My thoughts on why the G1 toy is the size it is are pretty simple: I think the designers wanted to make it kid size! It fits a child's hand perfectly!
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Ironhidensh » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:56 am

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Comparison Review: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1

Postby Va'al » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:57 am

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Something different for the new week, as fellow Seibertronian FracturedKoi returns to the Energon Pub with a comparison between the latest Transformers Masterpiece figure from Takara Tomy - MP-36 Megatron - and the original of the alt-mode it's trying to represent: a Walther P-38 gun (or a P-1, as they have done).

Whatever your opinion on firearms, the comparison is detailed and thoughtful - and you can check it out below complete with commentary and opinions from our fellow user. Then join the conversation in the Energon Pub!

FracturedKoi wrote:Good evening, friends! It's been far too long and I apologize for my absence from the forums. Facebook has just made connecting so much easier that I've neglected any presence on here, forgive me. It's okay though, because MP-36 just came out and I thought what a better way to come back to the forums than to shoot another set of comparison images.

I will admit that while I love the animation accurate look of his robot mode I honestly do not like his gun mode at all. Instead of seeking a license and reproducing a Walther P-38, they chose (possibly wisely?) to instead model his gun mode after his cartoon appearance. Now, I can understand why they'd do this. Less fees for licensing, slightly fewer headaches with firearm realism and the legal ramifications thereof, and perhaps even a little bit more creative freedom. In my mind, though, his alt-mode just suffers for it. Both his G1 iteration and the first MP version have a much more accurate gun mode.

But enough of that, on with the images. Following each image, I'll try to comment as to what I'm attempting to compare.

Image
Notice the size difference. While nowhere near as oversized as his first MP release, 36 is still far oversized.

Image
Another angle showing size differences. The plate on top of the gun (which contains the firing pin and safety mechanism) is much thicker. The only reason I can see for this is to allow for how they're attaching Megatron's scope (which is STILL a horrible idea and now it's even less feasible than it was on the G1 toy. That toy has a black bracket which is supposed to imply that it's attached to the frame and goes around the slide to prevent it from moving with the slide.) Interestingly enough, the sights on 36 are identical to those found on a Walther...but more on that later.

Image
Detail showing the grips. 36 still uses the WWII Bakelite grips and keeps many of the details spot on. Notice the safety is switched on for both guns. I've seen so many images of 36's safety flipped way out of alignment and it's bugged me to no end. Glad to know it does go where intended. The screw detail is still present on 36 as is the details for the takedown lever (out of frame) and slide lock (horizontal lever above trigger). Things really start to fall apart with the grips, though, as Takara has zero detail at the bottom for any sort of magazine functionality; they replaced it with the cartoon accurate bracket...thing. Ung. They also have no detail for the lanyard strap either.

Image
Side-by-side profile showing frame and grip details, safety now moved to fire position. Here you can clearly see the takedown lever (front of frame, close to Megatron's head). Of note, while G1 had "serial numbers" and even one of Walther's proof marks "stamped" on it, 36 has no such details anywhere. There isn't one place where a proof mark, serial number, or even the Walther banner were put on the toy. This isn't a Walther but it's mimicking one closely. Many of the gun details are so broken up by panels that it's difficult to tell what you're looking at. The takedown lever, for example, is split in half and has a pin running right through it on the toy.

Image
Image
Here's a pretty awesome detail, though: the front sights are dovetailed into position (well, not really, but kudos for the sculpting!)


Image
Image
More awesome detail work replicating the extractor. This little bar inlaid into the top of the slide grabs the casing of the spend round and flings it out and to the left of the shooter! On the toy, it too is split by seams and in two places no less! It's difficult to make a gun transform.

Image
Image
Sight picture on 36 is hindered greatly by the scope mount. However, by flipping that mounting point out 90 degrees, you're able to get a clear sight picture.

Image
Now, with the sight mount twisted to the side, you actually get a clear sight picture. Blam! Take that Lego castle! (I just noticed that some of these images aren't straight...sorry about that.)

Image
Image
Here's another great detail, that small plate you see on the real gun rides against the frame. That's your trigger mechanism and they replicated it on the toy! Awesome?

Image
From the rear with the hammer's cocked. Aside from 36 being horribly too thick, there's also nothing for his hammer to actually strike. The firing pin is that metallic circle you see on the actual firearm. The small circle above it is the loaded-chamber indicator. If a round is chambered, a small rod protrudes through that to let you know that yes, it is indeed ready to be fired.

Image
A Walther P-38 (or a P1, which is what I have) is chambered in 9mm. The barrel will nearly fit inside the toy's barrel! A 9mm would fall through that barrel like a penny through a well. I haven't measured the inside diameter of the toy's barrel to try and figure out what caliber it is.

Image
One last detail image: they've outlined the shape of the barrel as it's inserted into the slide. As the gun functions, the slide will, well...slide around the barrel, kinda like this:

Image
Shown is the slide locked back as it would be on an empty magazine.

I hope you guys have enjoyed this brief look at 36 and how he compares to a real firearm. He really does try, but that cartoon detailing just gets in his way from nailing it 100%. Whatever the case, this figure truly is a masterpiece. Thanks for your time, guys and gals, and have a great night!
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Microraptor » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:12 am

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This is really cool! Thanks for the info.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby FracturedKoi » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:39 am

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Ironhidensh wrote:Dude, is that the Lego Disney Cinderella castle I'm the background?


Yes, yes it is ;D
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby DecepticonFinishline » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:51 am

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Awesome! Good to know. I'm not a gun enthusiast, but I was certainly curious about how close it came to the real thing. After seeing this, I am feeling that it is the best balance of all modes. But... I am biased because I love this figure.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby galvatron00 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 7:37 am

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Excellent comparison FracturedKoi!! :APPLAUSE:

I do find it interesting how they kept some of the tiny specific details and then went completely cartoon in others. I agree with you that licensing and "toy gun" issues are what kept them from going full details.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby triKlops » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:20 am

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Nice comparison shots; thanks! ;)^
Very informative.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby WreckerJack » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:55 am

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Seems the most notable difference is the width. Megatron is wider than the P-38. Which makes sense. A gun should be smaller to be carried, but a Transforming robot needs more bulk so that the figure is properly sized and detailed in robot mode.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Rated X » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:25 am

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Well of course its gonna be bigger to scale properly with other MP figures in robot mode. It would have been nice if it was licensed and resembled the actual firearm instead of a "not" P-38 similar to how hasbro often does their CHUG alt modes. But I can see why they would go with cartoon accuracy to save money. Once you add some chrome not to mention the fictional silencer, scope, and stock, you pretty much throw firearm accuracy out the window anyway. I would love to see a gun collecter customize the actual firearm to look like megatrons G1 toy. The chrome deco is entirely possible for a price. Bonus points if a shop can create functioning add on parts that mount on to the gun and really work. Although one thing I never understood about the fictional alt mode is why a gun with strong enough kickback to require a stock would have a scope/viewfinder? Obviously you couldn't look through it to aim at a target while the stock is properly placed against your shoulder to to absorb the recoil.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Jelze Bunnycat » Mon Apr 17, 2017 12:53 pm

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Rated X wrote:Although one thing I never understood about the fictional alt mode is why a gun with strong enough kickback to require a stock would have a scope/viewfinder? Obviously you couldn't look through it to aim at a target while the stock is properly placed against your shoulder to to absorb the recoil.


The scope, stock and that particular model of silencer are entirely fictional, as no official add-ons, silencers aside, have been released for that type of firearm. They're all from the 60's series The Man from U.N.C.L.E..
Besides, I highly doubt a conventional pistol could be turned into a sniper rifle so easily. :lol:
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Evil Eye » Mon Apr 17, 2017 2:32 pm

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A very interesting comparison! A shame that the figure diverges so far from the gun design, but I do commend them for the little details they did include. It would have been nice for a more authentic, properly licensed P-38 mode though.

Also I must say that the P-38 really is a beautiful gun. I don't know the most about guns but it sure is elegant.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby BATTLEMASTER IIC » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:15 pm

JelZe GoldRabbit wrote:The scope, stock and that particular model of silencer are entirely fictional, as no official add-ons, silencers aside, have been released for that type of firearm. They're all from the 60's series The Man from U.N.C.L.E..
Besides, I highly doubt a conventional pistol could be turned into a sniper rifle so easily. :lol:


Even if you could put a scope on a Walther P1, you wouldn't put your eye right up to the scope's eyepiece, otherwise the recoil of the weapon would put the eyepiece into your eye, and give you a black eye and a headache! You aim through a scope with your eye a few inches away from the eyepiece.
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby fenrir72 » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:12 pm

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Rated X wrote:Well of course its gonna be bigger to scale properly with other MP figures in robot mode. It would have been nice if it was licensed and resembled the actual firearm instead of a "not" P-38 similar to how hasbro often does their CHUG alt modes. But I can see why they would go with cartoon accuracy to save money. Once you add some chrome not to mention the fictional silencer, scope, and stock, you pretty much throw firearm accuracy out the window anyway. I would love to see a gun collecter customize the actual firearm to look like megatrons G1 toy. The chrome deco is entirely possible for a price. Bonus points if a shop can create functioning add on parts that mount on to the gun and really work. Although one thing I never understood about the fictional alt mode is why a gun with strong enough kickback to require a stock would have a scope/viewfinder? Obviously you couldn't look through it to aim at a target while the stock is properly placed against your shoulder to to absorb the recoil.


Fictional toy based on a fictional show the irony yes?
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Re: MP-36 Megatron vs. a real Walther P1: comparison part two

Postby Ultra Markus » Mon Apr 17, 2017 8:12 pm

Motto: "“You either die a hero or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain.” - Harvey Dent in The Dark Knight"
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why not do a comparision with the G1 toy vs the real one also :-?
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