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You know, this is really sad...

So many of you bitched and complained about the crude humor and what many thought were lame jokes. We get word that bay has made a desion to change this and tone it down. And what do we get? More bitching and complaining from the fan base.
I mean com'on people... Bay is listening to the fans and giving them what they wanted. He's responding to all the criticism in a good way and all he gets in return is smut. You guys are really sad. This is not how you continue to get your voice heard. Remember, he doesn't have to do this. He's not obligated to give us anything!! SO if you want to keep having your voice heard, then start showing some damn appreciation!!! Doubting him and calling him a lair isn't going to help!!

5150 Cruiser wrote:You know, this is really sad...

So many of you bitched and complained about the crude humor and what many thought were lame jokes. We get word that bay has made a desion to change this and tone it down. And what do we get? More bitching and complaining from the fan base.
I mean com'on people... Bay is listening to the fans and giving them what they wanted. He's responding to all the criticism in a good way and all he gets in return is smut. You guys are really sad. This is not how you continue to get your voice heard. Remember, he doesn't have to do this. He's not obligated to give us anything!! SO if you want to keep having your voice heard, then start showing some damn appreciation!!! Doubting him and calling him a lair isn't going to help!!

I agree with every post that you write in this forum man. Thanks and keep up the good work.

Ha ha, a forum side kick, thats new.
It's funny, I was going to call BS on the reportings, and it seems half if not more of the members here beat me too it. Seems like we're all Jaded at this point, still, none can blame us, though many try. Amusing.

There will always be a sense of Bays humor in these films, Bay can't help it. If he can tone it down, alot, then that would be a big improvement. Right now he has alot of damage control to do, not just for fan bases which I can assure you isn't his main concern, but he's recieving alot of flak from the industry itself. Right now I think Bay is in trouble with being type casted as to what type of director he is in-industry. Which is deadly for ones career. I'm sure him wanting to prove himself will rub off somewhat on this 3rd film (Mind the high hopes there though) but I think honestly, he just wants to be rid of this franchise while the studio just wants to bank on it.

I would say the safest thing for him to do is go back and reuse the formula he did for the first film, which kinda was already reused and then butchered with the unassurace of being a comedy for the second film. the first film pretty much everyone loved, me included. Stick with that, and wrap it up nice and neat and the path to damage control will have begun.
Laters,
Josh

Producer Lorenzo di Bonaventura says the rush strained the plot: "We tried to do too many things in the second movie, which didn't give enough time in any one of them. We were constantly jumping to the next piece of information, the next place."

Left out of that quote: "But I needed a new Porsche and house, and the rest of the Paramount executives lost returns on some capital investments so we greenlit the pic for a 2009 release. We knew it would make money regardless of how bad it'd turn out so we said &*^% it. &*%$ the fans. We didn't think about waiting an extra year like most sequels and most franchises. &*(% it. Just put it out."

Omega Charge wrote:Hey, getting rid of the cheap comedy and focusing on the plot and characters (which sound promising based on the recent news) could be just what the third movie needs to be a fantastic climax to the trilogy (and much better than ROTF). The comedy in TF2 was just too much, and it kept being distracting and killing the pace of the story. If Bay stays true to his word, I think TF3 will be quite awesome.

Good post. Of course it is yet to be seen, but I think you are correct in this estimation.

Reading Bay's quote makes me think of the movie "Mystery Men", where Michael Bay played one of the Frat. Boys, who's character was crude and dorky. I wonder if that is where Bay gets all of his inspiration. Or perhaps, it is just inate.

I still say it was those two hack writers responsible for it, and Bay's just taking the credit now that they're gone.

Burn wrote:I still say it was those two hack writers responsible for it, and Bay's just taking the credit now that they're gone.

you mean 3. Don't forget Ehren Kruger.

Nobody read my di Bonaventura (mis)quote???

he'd better. plus the plot holes and glitches

vectorA3 wrote:

Burn wrote:I still say it was those two hack writers responsible for it, and Bay's just taking the credit now that they're gone.

you mean 3. Don't forget Ehren Kruger.

Nobody read my di Bonaventura (mis)quote???

I got your back bro, good missquote hahaha. And truth be told, how things probably played out with upper management. Damn producers and production houses and the lot. Hence why they pushed TF3 for 2011, same reasons, hopefully wth no strike ad a humbled Director we may get something wachable..if not hey at least it's in 3D ;D

vectorA3 wrote:

Burn wrote:I still say it was those two hack writers responsible for it, and Bay's just taking the credit now that they're gone.

you mean 3. Don't forget Ehren Kruger.

He wasn't there for Bumblebee taking a leak.

Albershide wrote:
I agree with every post that you write in this forum man. Thanks and keep up the good work.

Thanks Bro! I just speak my mind.

Joshua Vallse wrote: Ha ha, a forum side kick, thats new.
It's funny, I was going to call BS on the reportings, and it seems half if not more of the members here beat me too it. Seems like we're all Jaded at this point, still, none can blame us, though many try. Amusing.

Sure we can blame ya. Why be jaded? Last year bay warned that their might be some mis information going around, only because of the hack on Bay's computer. Anyways, i don't recall him lieing on anything concerning the last movie anyways. he did listen to fans and the general public alike. was it perfect? No. But it is a work in progress.

Joshua Vallse wrote: There will always be a sense of Bays humor in these films, Bay can't help it. If he can tone it down, alot, then that would be a big improvement. Right now he has alot of damage control to do, not just for fan bases which I can assure you isn't his main concern, but he's recieving alot of flak from the industry itself..

Sure their will be. He said it would be toned down, not rid of completly. And while the Fan base may not be his main concern, he seems to be listening. I really don't know what flak within the industry your talking about. The movie was 2nd ranking last year making well over $800,000,000. More than the first movie (whitch is rare). I doubt he really cares about the rasberry award given out by a b-rate website. All he's trying to do is improve over his last installment. Thats what every director should do.

Joshua Vallse wrote: I think honestly, he just wants to be rid of this franchise while the studio just wants to bank on it. ..

If this is true, then i don't blame him. Most aren't very gratfull for what they've recieved anyways. He atempts to give fans what they wanted, and still gets crap for it. At this point, it might not even be worth listening to the fans.
As for the studio, ya they do want to just bank on it. how is that any different than hasbro wanting to just bank on the franchise since its conception in the 80's?

Joshua Vallse wrote:I would say the safest thing for him to do is go back and reuse the formula he did for the first film, which kinda was already reused and then butchered with the unassurace of being a comedy for the second film. the first film pretty much everyone loved, me included. Stick with that, and wrap it up nice and neat and the path to damage control will have begun.
Laters,
Josh

In a sence, i agree. But to be honest, he needs to combine aspects of both movies. Give us the simple plot we had in the first, with the robot action of the second, along with the character development of Jetfire, and we'll have a winner. Everything else can be worked out along the way.

what the fans wanted? Flames on Optimus Prime?? Bay wanted that.

the obnoxious jokes with Leo & the twins -- what he & the writers wanted.

30 min. of that bs could've been cut out of the movie, lessening the pain for us, but no -- Bay pretty much has final cut & left what HE wanted in.

vectorA3 wrote:what the fans wanted? Flames on Optimus Prime?? Bay wanted that.

the obnoxious jokes with Leo & the twins -- what he & the writers wanted.

30 min. of that bs could've been cut out of the movie, lessening the pain for us, but no -- Bay pretty much has final cut & left what HE wanted in.

Oh god, are you still stuck on the whole "flames on Optimus" kic are you? Ya, bay did want them. So what? Did that really ruin the movie for you?

Ya, he and the writers did add the twins and leo cause they wanted to. There putting there hard work into the movie. So be it that they add a few things that they wanted to.
But what about the stuff that bay listened to? Less shakey cam; more robots, more action and fight scenes for the robots. Not everything is going to be perfect. But its evident someone is listening.

Ahhhhh,
Just finished watching Episodes of Zoids Genesis....pity that show never made it to CTN before they cancelled Toonami.
Oh right right Transformers hahaha.
Still amusing, most of this...but I will spar. If only to tucker myself out so I can sleep

I'm all for supporting this war after all ha ha ha! <----Anime Laugh Why are people Jaded? Why not, hell the writers and actors and even the director is jaded to some point. Better question, why aren't your jaded?

$=Awesome movie. No, thats not how it works. It's more complicated then that of couse, but I'm sleepy right now so I'll leave it to "Nothing else was really playing for the kiddies till Ice Age 3 came out." Pick this apart or build on it to ones whim..I'll be back to elaborate more...mayb

Go for it Production houses, bleed this cash cow dry! Well, it's nice they have some green lights here, they really don't care either way but still, I'm sure they appreciate the support. Especially with the pushed release date NO ONE wanted..actors and director included. It's refreshing one is appeased by the table scraps.

Annnnnnnndddddd.....I think that should do it for now. Have fun with this, I'll be back to elaborate more..if I'm not still watching ZOIDs Genesis ha ha ha. Thats a really good show too, and everyone knows I like putting robots, big and small, together
En Guard!
Josh

5150 Cruiser wrote:

vectorA3 wrote:what the fans wanted? Flames on Optimus Prime?? Bay wanted that.

the obnoxious jokes with Leo & the twins -- what he & the writers wanted.

30 min. of that bs could've been cut out of the movie, lessening the pain for us, but no -- Bay pretty much has final cut & left what HE wanted in.

Oh god, are you still stuck on the whole "flames on Optimus" kic are you? Ya, bay did want them. So what? Did that really ruin the movie for you?

Ya, he and the writers did add the twins and leo cause they wanted to. There putting there hard work into the movie. So be it that they add a few things that they wanted to.
But what about the stuff that bay listened to? Less shakey cam; more robots, more action and fight scenes for the robots. Not everything is going to be perfect. But its evident someone is listening.

i wouldn't give Bay that much credit, more fights & more robots are inevitable for a 2nd movie of any TF trilogy -regardless of the director. TF is not a music video & he treats it way too much like that. His only redeeming feature is shooting the stunts/live action well. But still, eye candy is not enough - you need to have a good story/drama to make the actions sequences even more meaningful. Not useless filler and lame high school/middle school jokes. Once he masters that, then i won't b*&%h.

Joshua Vallse wrote:
Still amusing, most of this...but I will spar. If only to tucker myself out so I can sleep

Ha ha, then when all my best thoughts come to mind. Right before bed I don't have enough energy to do much but think. Doesn't last to long though... Ha ha.

Joshua Vallse wrote: I'm all for supporting this war after all ha ha ha! <----Anime Laugh Why are people Jaded? Why not, hell the writers and actors and even the director is jaded to some point. Better question, why aren't your jaded?

Oh, believe me, I am. Just not on this particular subject. After all, its good news. The actors, director, and producers are "jaded" enough to be going in the right direction.

Joshua Vallse wrote:$=Awesome movie. No, thats not how it works. It's more complicated then that of course, but I'm sleepy right now so I'll leave it to "Nothing else was really playing for the kiddies till Ice Age 3 came out." Pick this apart or build on it to ones whim..I'll be back to elaborate more...mayb

To an extent, your right. But alot of this is subjective as well. Many have different views on what makes a good movie. I usually tend to disagree with critics as to what is actually good or not. For instance Avatar..
Other than the special affects, and visuals, i don't believe it brought out anything different in the movie industry. Same story thats been rehashed over and over. No incredible acting. nothing really special in my eyes in terms of an actual movie. But it was successfully in its own right. The general public responded by making it the number one grossing movie of all time. No matter how you feel about the movie it elf, the director/producers gave the general public what they wanted. I can say i didn't like it, but to I can't say that it was any kind of an abomination. It was a success. Then there was the abomination that was "Precious".
How anyone could have gotten Emmy's and Oscars for swearing, child abuse, profound use of the "N" word is completely beyond me. Personally, i don't feel this "movie" was even watchable. It sucked. Though i think alot of the general public feels the same way. Media, and the industry seems to think this is what makes good acting. This is the type of story that people want to see. Oh well... I'm just not "hip" and "In tune" i guess. I'll take roots beating the crap out of each other over slumps of society any day.

Vector A3:
Don't B&%$& about b#&$%-ing about the lack of story! See what I did there Anyways you have the perfect reason to dislike something, lack of story! This is my biggest pet peve because really, story is everything! Without a story, and FX thriller is just a demo reel, like I've stated so many times before, and everyone needs story. Story is key! STORY!!!!!!! So....B&$%& away! XD

5150 Cruiser:
Yeah I have to let my mind wind down so I just post what I can till I'm too sleepy to do anything else. Works out pretty well.

As for films, it's all intertwined....film that don't do well gross wise but are largely accepted and praised, especially indie films, tend to build certain reps to which the directors can capitalize on. They get more opportunities to experiment, more jobs and hopefully become producers to make more money and bug around directors of their own some day (Speilberg!) while still recieving credit. The worst thing a director can have though, is being typecasted. Right now Bay is typecasted as the explosion victoria secret guy. Beyond that, he has no credit to much of anything. Maybe he's happy with this, I don't know, but he doesn't seem happy in terms of capping off the remainder of the trilogy, even going as far as to say someone should reboot the series without him in a recent interview..or was it on this thread? Either way, he's taking baby steps, hiring great actors like Malcovich while also taking steps backwards like hiring eye candy soley to be eyecandy....i mean the premis itself doesn't really even stick. Sam scoring a hot girl as result of an alien war...okay, sure. That was a pretty outstanding moment so I'll believe it...it happeing twice and this time with a underware model? Ugh....just ugh. Suttle things like this, even in a franchise which is obviously made to appeal to both young and old, tend to ruin things, unless the pretty FX and eyecandy are enough for some. Which obviously it is, most notably the kiddies. I mean it's a theory, but a damn good one because TF2 reigned for a good while with nothing else being released for the children, it was a perfect moment for the film to capitalize. Then Ice Age 3 came out and the first hint of competition, it's weekly intake was chopped in half. Later on, it fizzled away. So it's gross intake I will accredit to very very special ciurcumstances. However again...$ isn't eveyrhting. On the flip end of the coin the Resident Evil series really didn't do well at all, yet it keeps getting green lit for sequels. How? Oh God how? Another film was the Boondock Saint's series which is a cult classic and one of my own fav series, especially the sequel and yet it made very very very little money in gross. It's all kind of nutty, no matter how you look at it A good film really is just one subjective to each person's taste. I have certain film standards which i use to gague what I watch just as I'm sure you and many others do. But i will say that the key to any good film always will be story. Which i will say right out ROTF didn't have. The framework may have been there, but it wasn't greatly executed. In fact I will say I did like the first quarter of the film, but something happened and it all fell apart and I could feel the film was rushed, which myself and others have tried to find reasons why, and we found none. Again the production houses just wanted their film out too soon just as they want this new film out too soon. So, in the end, hopefully we et something at the least entertaining....if it surpases that I'll be happy. If not I wont be surprised.

My God did i write all that! Geez, tea I drank must have had alot of caffine O.O
Alright I'm off, but keep the war going peeps, we must keep the war going till TF3 is released!!!!!!

bottom line (to the studios): If you're gonna whore out our beloved TF franchise & make money - I wanna see it done right, or closer to 'right' than what they've done so far.

Joshua Vallse wrote:Either way, he's taking baby steps, hiring great actors like Malcovich while also taking steps backwards like hiring eye candy soley to be eyecandy....i mean the premis itself doesn't really even stick. Sam scoring a hot girl as result of an alien war...okay, sure. That was a pretty outstanding moment so I'll believe it...it happeing twice and this time with a underware model? Ugh....just ugh.

Ok this kind of talk is starting to annoy me. People talk like they can read Bay's mind. Were you there when she was cast? Do you have any idea what role she's playing? No? So wait for some actual information before you act like you know everything.

Suttle things like this, even in a franchise which is obviously made to appeal to both young and old, tend to ruin things, unless the pretty FX and eyecandy are enough for some. Which obviously it is, most notably the kiddies. I mean it's a theory, but a damn good one because TF2 reigned for a good while with nothing else being released for the children, it was a perfect moment for the film to capitalize. Then Ice Age 3 came out and the first hint of competition, it's weekly intake was chopped in half. Later on, it fizzled away. So it's gross intake I will accredit to very very special ciurcumstances.

Umm NO, Ice Age 3 came out the next week, and RotF made slightly more than it. I don't know what point your trying to make anyway, every movie makes less money over time. If you want to make a point back it up with actual facts and not something you pulled out of your hindquarters.

Joshua Vallse wrote:Vector A3:
Don't B&%$& about b#&$%-ing about the lack of story! See what I did there Anyways you have the perfect reason to dislike something, lack of story! This is my biggest pet peve because really, story is everything! Without a story, and FX thriller is just a demo reel, like I've stated so many times before, and everyone needs story. Story is key! STORY!!!!!!! So....B&$%& away! XD

Tell that to G1. I mean I watched a G1 episode last night, it was awesome, even one of my favorite G1 episodes ever! But there where plot holes up my ass!

Joshua Vallse wrote:Vector A3:
Don't B&%$& about b#&$%-ing about the lack of story! See what I did there Anyways you have the perfect reason to dislike something, lack of story! This is my biggest pet peve because really, story is everything! Without a story, and FX thriller is just a demo reel, like I've stated so many times before, and everyone needs story. Story is key! STORY!!!!!!! So....B&$%& away! XD

Ha ha.. Now thats funny. Good stories have NEVER been a strong point for any TF series. G1 being a prime example of this. I mean, its entertaining in its own right. But you really can't complain about having some Superior story when the source material is lacking.

SlyTF1 wrote:Tell that to G1. I mean I watched a G1 episode last night, it was awesome, even one of my favorite G1 episodes ever! But there where plot holes up my ass!

Exactly. Don't get me wrong. I like G1. Its actually great background when your working. But the cheese factor is ridiculous. Even for the 80's.

Maybe he didn't think either of the first two movies had any dorky comedy and we'll probably just end up with more of the same.

5150 Cruiser wrote:

Joshua Vallse wrote:Vector A3:
Don't B&%$& about b#&$%-ing about the lack of story! See what I did there Anyways you have the perfect reason to dislike something, lack of story! This is my biggest pet peve because really, story is everything! Without a story, and FX thriller is just a demo reel, like I've stated so many times before, and everyone needs story. Story is key! STORY!!!!!!! So....B&$%& away! XD

Ha ha.. Now thats funny. Good stories have NEVER been a strong point for any TF series. G1 being a prime example of this. I mean, its entertaining in its own right. But you really can't complain about having some Superior story when the source material is lacking.

Except Beast Wars and Animated.

HA HA!
The War continues, yay!

Vector, totally agree. Better story, always a better story.

Evil the Nub, Yay, another sparring partner. Hum...lets see what we have. Annoying, eh not the worst thing I've been called. Though the context of your statement in relation to the quote you chose is puzzling, how does me simply stating facts as revealed from the movie and the news qualify as mind reading? I mean....how? As far as Rosie's role, well she was hired to replace Megan Fox, and her only prior qualification is a Underwear model, and we only really have two choices....new character, or Megan's character....soooooooooooo, how am I jumping to anything other then the obivous? Regadless, it's not telepathy, just observation. Easy peasy.

Ah, Ice Age came out next week, well this further hammers home my prvious point being TF's primary audience was children dishing out cash to see the robots blow up over and over and over. And it's weekly gross dropped dramatically at the first sign of competition via targeted audience (Children) And I did state it was theory, in case you missed that. And I'm sure if you put an accent into it you can say Arse-hole ala Jetfire. In you can't please exscuse and forgive me moderators. I wont do it again.

5150 Cruiser and Sly TF1:

Heh, glad you liked my pep talk. However here I will reveal my deep dark secret for all the TF world to judge......I never follwed the G1 cartoon as a child.

"WHAT! He's a witch burn him!"

Ha ha, I assure you I'm not, however this being said the reason I liked TF1 was because I didn't have anything else to compare it too, and it's story was solid enough for me to enjoy. I was happily surpirsed. Hence, when I say they dropped the ball with TF2 story wise, I'm only comparing it to TF1 and other live action films in the genre. The only Tf cartoon's I did follow, were the 1st animated movie, and Beast Wars, which had significant story development. Hence I stick by my story argument. There was a frame there for the story, but they dropped it. Also I didn't like the asthetic they had with alot of the robot designs, and this comes from me as an artist more then a TF fan. You can't strafe too far from te original insparation of your rebooted characters. Or else it's something completely different entirely. US Godzilla being the prime example. If they named that movie something else, it would have probably been greatly recieved. In fact if that beastie was the beastie in Cloverfeild, I would have loved it. Rather, they naed it Godzilla, and it wasn't, hence the fallout. Same rule applies here with the TF franchise.
I didnt like Devastator cause he was a glorified Vaccume
I didn't like the Bike triplets because they were bad versions of Gizmo Duck
I dnd't like the twins because they were just ugly as hell. and really served no purpose plot wise. In fact I can edit all of TF2 without the twins and it would still work out just fine....sadly.
And I didn't like Jetfire just because I saw potential wasted. I wanted this awesome aireal battle between him and Starscream and instead got old man river. Sigh
Oh well, at least this film is in 3D ha ha ha
Till round 2...or is it 3? XD
Josh